red tape in New Brunswick

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S. St. Jeb
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red tape in New Brunswick

Postby S. St. Jeb » Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:44 pm

http://www.canadianbeernews.com/2014/07 ... uor-rules/

I don't have the same hate of our LCBO and liquor system in Ontario as some of you do, but if I lived in NB, this would make me furious.
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Postby rejtable » Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:00 am

It is really insane.

The CEO of NB Liquor or whatever his title is a former Diageo and Molson exec. Go figure.
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Postby S. St. Jeb » Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:44 pm

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Postby MatttthewGeorge » Mon Jul 28, 2014 11:01 pm

S. St. Jeb wrote:Some common sense appears


Not much. Grand-fathering in these two breweries does not make up for an unjust law, it just allows the two to operate within it. It's still unjust... and plain old stupid.
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rejtable
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Postby rejtable » Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:15 am

Exactly.

The only thing that can cause some optimism here is that this grandfathering thing just buys the NB liquor time to figure out a way to back out of this mess quietly.

If they actually stick to this and grandfather the only two breweries currently impacted but keep out all newcomers... well, that's even crazier than coming up with this insane rule in the first place.
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Craig
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Postby Craig » Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:05 am

rejtable wrote:Exactly.

The only thing that can cause some optimism here is that this grandfathering thing just buys the NB liquor time to figure out a way to back out of this mess quietly.

If they actually stick to this and grandfather the only two breweries currently impacted but keep out all newcomers... well, that's even crazier than coming up with this insane rule in the first place.


It's pretty much how the Ontario wine and beer markets work, with the Beer Store and Wine Rack and whatever that other wine store is called.
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Postby rejtable » Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:54 am

I know what you mean, but it's not the same at all. This is preventing other breweries who don't sell a pretty significant volume through NB Liquor from selling retail at their own location.

As f'd up as things are in ON, a brewery's ability/choice to sell beer through LCBO or Beer Store has no impact on their ability/choice to sell direct from your brewery. That's what NB is/was trying to do. If you didn't sell a reasonably big quantity of beer (for these small guys anyway) through NB Liquor, you couldn't sell direct to consumers.

That rule is still in place, just not for the two breweries in question... the only two it currently impacts. But if Acadie Broue decided to open a retail shop, He wouldn't be allowed under this rule.
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Postby zane9 » Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:24 pm

I'm still looking for NB Liquor's rationale for its original decision. Absent any plausible explanation, are we seeing the firm hand of Moosehead, for example?

I believe that wineries and cideries can sell from the farmgate in NB. Why not beer at the brewery?

Meantime, the decision to allow the two breweries to be exempt has just made the situation even worse: any following startups would have to beg for statutory relief on a case-by-case basis.

I'm sure they could litigate, but the costs would be prohibitive and with an uncertain result.
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Postby Craig » Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:19 pm

It seems crazy to me that this is a thing. Even if it is just the beer lobby writing the regulations, is cornering the New Brunswick beer market really that important to them? Seems like the sort of thing they would want to get done in much larger markets.
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Postby rejtable » Wed Jul 30, 2014 7:14 pm

zane9 wrote:I'm still looking for NB Liquor's rationale for its original decision. Absent any plausible explanation, are we seeing the firm hand of Moosehead, for example?

I believe that wineries and cideries can sell from the farmgate in NB. Why not beer at the brewery?

Meantime, the decision to allow the two breweries to be exempt has just made the situation even worse: any following startups would have to beg for statutory relief on a case-by-case basis.

I'm sure they could litigate, but the costs would be prohibitive and with an uncertain result.
From the outside looking in this looks like equal parts incompetence and evil.

Incompetence...NB Liquor, remember, is the group who tried selling their own brand under the guise of fighting cheap beer from Quebec. And one of their publicly stated goals (whether true or not is another matter) of this new policy was that they wanted to basically sell more beer themselves. So, I guess it's possible in their stupid heads that they thought this was beer that was going to market either way so why not force it through their stores?

And evil as I can't imagine how this doesn't have the fingerprints of the big breweries all over it.

It seems crazy to me that this is a thing. Even if it is just the beer lobby writing the regulations, is cornering the New Brunswick beer market really that important to them? Seems like the sort of thing they would want to get done in much larger markets.
I wonder to what extent the various regional managers of the big breweries work reasonably autonomously. In other words, if the "Easter Canadian Manager" or whatever he'd be called is more or less free to do what he can to keep every drop of beer share, then I can see how this kind of thing would happen. Kind of like the Diageo clowns who screwed up/fixed the brewdog award a few years ago.
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Postby saints_gambit » Thu Jul 31, 2014 3:34 pm

I spoke to the President of the NBLC and he quoted odd ideas about people bootlegging craft beer. I do not believe that anyone is really seriously considering bootlegging craft beer, but even if they were it's already illegal. The rationale is a bad one.
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Postby rejtable » Fri Aug 01, 2014 6:55 am

saints_gambit wrote:I spoke to the President of the NBLC and he quoted odd ideas about people bootlegging craft beer. I do not believe that anyone is really seriously considering bootlegging craft beer, but even if they were it's already illegal. The rationale is a bad one.
Haha

Sounds like the people behind The Beer Store's "kids will be forcefed beer at convenience store" ads maybe feeding the NB guy his lines.
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Postby zane9 » Sat Aug 16, 2014 8:21 am

UPDATE: NB Liquor drops minimum sales quota!

Great news for the microbrewers, especially the startups.

http://www.canadianbeernews.com/2014/08 ... breweries/
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Postby instantkamera » Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:00 pm

Somewhat related, NB provincial markup is fucking insane. I foolishly assumed it was comparable to ON and ended up paying ~$93 to import ~$100 worth of beer. I felt violated.
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Postby iguenard » Thu Aug 28, 2014 9:15 pm

instantkamera wrote:Somewhat related, NB provincial markup is fucking insane. I foolishly assumed it was comparable to ON and ended up paying ~$93 to import ~$100 worth of beer. I felt violated.


In Quebec, private imports of kegs is 150-200%. We feel your pain.

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