Brewing a Westy 12 clone

atomeyes · Post by **atomeyes** » Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:16 pm

anyone in the mood to attempt to brew a clone?

the malt bill can be found in Brew Like a Monk.

Think i've seen it as:

6.00 lb Belgian Pale
9.00 lb Belgian Pilsner
2.00 lb D-180 Candi Syrup

Hops:

Brewers Gold Pellet 1.00 oz at 60 min
Hallertau Pellet 1.00 oz at 20 min
Hersbrucker Pellet 1.00 oz at 5 min

90 min boil.

Yeast: Westmalle yeast from either Wyeth or White. have a big, fat starter (2 litres). Pitch to beer. Ferment so the krausen gets big (temp should be close to 80 F on the most active day). Drop to low-70s for 4 days. Rack to secondary in mid-60s for a week to 10 days. Cold crash it for 10-12 weeks at low end cellar temps.

Water profile: anyone know how Toronto's water compares to Westvleteren's water?

Thoughts? Anyone try it?

JasonTremblay · Post by **JasonTremblay** » Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:05 pm

Toronto's water is fine for most Belgians, just make sure it's carbon-filtered.

Also, since your malt bill is pale, I'd acidulate your mash. But with something other than Five Star 5.2 (it keeps a pale mash using Toronto water at 5.8). Westie is comparatively dry for such a big beer, and you want good conditions in your mash to pull off that neat trick.

You should also have a look at Mr. Malty for some info about sizing your starter -- http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html . Assuming a SG of 1.090, a textbook pitch would be something closer to a 6l simple starter or 2.5l with a stirplate starter.

FWIW, I think a stirplate, while not quite a necessity for high gravity brewing, does make life easier since your starters can be smaller. And the swirling vortex of yeasty goodness tends to drop the yeast out of suspension very fast once the plate is turned off -- the volume of slurry you end up pitching is FAR smaller than what you'd typically see with a simple starter.

Jason

grub · Post by **grub** » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:53 am

i designed our quad recipe aiming at an aged westy, with all the dark fruit character and no spicy character (I find it is spicy young but that mellows with time). it's a simple combo of pilsner, munich, and special B. something fairly mellow for bittering (northern brewer/northdown/magnum) and hersbrucker and/or styrians around 15min. i always use wlp530 as i know it's supposed to be the westmalle strain and I also know from experience that it behaves well at different fermentation temperatures (BLAM suggests against this at homebrewing scale with commercial yeast samples, but I've had good luck with it). good caramelization through a long boil and/or a "magic elixir". caramelization and yeast@temp are the two keys for me on this one.

markham's water is pretty neutral, so i don't treat it or anything fancy. definitely build up a big starter or repitch onto the cake from a small beer, but that applies to any big beer. Interestingly though, BLAM also mentions that some brewers deliberately underpitch as the compounds released by the yeast when they're a little stressed can provide a desired character. I still prefer a big pitch to be on the safe side.

atomeyes · Post by **atomeyes** » Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:36 am

grub wrote:i designed our quad recipe aiming at an aged westy, with all the dark fruit character and no spicy character (I find it is spicy young but that mellows with time). it's a simple combo of pilsner, munich, and special B. something fairly mellow for bittering (northern brewer/northdown/magnum) and hersbrucker and/or styrians around 15min. i always use wlp530 as i know it's supposed to be the westmalle strain and I also know from experience that it behaves well at different fermentation temperatures (BLAM suggests against this at homebrewing scale with commercial yeast samples, but I've had good luck with it). good caramelization through a long boil and/or a "magic elixir". caramelization and yeast@temp are the two keys for me on this one.

markham's water is pretty neutral, so i don't treat it or anything fancy. definitely build up a big starter or repitch onto the cake from a small beer, but that applies to any big beer. Interestingly though, BLAM also mentions that some brewers deliberately underpitch as the compounds released by the yeast when they're a little stressed can provide a desired character. I still prefer a big pitch to be on the safe side.

i don't get underpitching. worried about a stalled fermentation.

J343MY · Post by **J343MY** » Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:34 pm

I've been thinking about brewing something like this for a while now, I've just never got around to it. Sometime soon though I think.

markaberrant · Post by **markaberrant** » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:22 pm

I've liked my dark strongs best with nothing but base malt, 2lbs of the extra dark syrup, table sugar and the Westmalle yeast. I target an OG of 1.080 from the malt, plus 20 combined points from syrup and sugar. Needs to finish dry (1.012 at the most), be well carbonated and aged for awhile to get the right flavour profile.

Tapsucker · Post by **Tapsucker** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:10 pm

I'm probably one of the few people on the planet that isn't that infatuated with this beer, or at least certainly not enough to take a vow of celibacy to try and clone it right!

grub · Post by **grub** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:08 pm

Tapsucker wrote:I'm probably one of the few people on the planet that isn't that infatuated with this beer, or at least certainly not enough to take a vow of celibacy to try and clone it right!

hehe, certainly no celibacy needed! i try to brew my "ideal quad" regardless. if that happens to be close to westy, cool... but i'm certainly not going to diminish the recipe if someone else tells me it isn't "right".

markaberrant · Post by **markaberrant** » Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:39 am

exactly, I aint trying to brew a Westy clone, just a killer quad that I like.

atomeyes · Post by **atomeyes** » Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:24 pm

Tapsucker wrote:I'm probably one of the few people on the planet that isn't that infatuated with this beer, or at least certainly not enough to take a vow of celibacy to try and clone it right!

you jelly?
you jelly.

duncan · Post by **duncan** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:45 pm

This one pops up a few times in searches.

Recipe Type: All Grain
Yeast: WLP 530
Yeast Starter: 2-3L
Batch Size (Gallons): 5.5
Original Gravity: 1.071
Final Gravity: 1.015
IBU: ?
Boiling Time (Minutes): 60
Color: ?
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 days at 68
Additional Fermentation: Bottle condition for 3 weeks
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 days at 68
Tasting Notes: See below

Grain:

17.5 lb Dingemans Belgian Pilsner
1 lb Caramunich (belg)
.44 lb Biscuit
.31 lb Aromatic
.25 lb Special B
.19 lb Chocolate

Candi Sugar:
1 bottle of the Dark Candi Syrup(this is key, use the syrup)
.25 Amber Rock Candi
Added with 15 mins left in the boil

Hops:
1.25 oz. Styrian Golding (60 min)
.25 oz. Styrian Goldings (15 min)
.25 oz. Haullertauer (15 min)
.25 oz. Styrian Goldings (1 min)
.25 oz. Haullertauer (1 min)

Yeast: WLP 530 (probably gonna want to make a 1 gallon starter)

Single infusion mash at 149 for 90 min. Mash out at 170 for 10-15 min. Sparge at 170. Boil for 60 minutes.

I did this one last november and its awesome! Lots of sweet, molasses and raisins a little heavy on the tounge with a suprisingly crisp finish.

grub · Post by **grub** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:42 pm

chocolate malt?!? i think the monks would laugh you out of the abbey.

atomeyes · Post by **atomeyes** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 7:52 am

as an aside, I made some "Belgian" rock candy last night for stocking stuffers. Got some really nice fruit notes out of it when i left it boil (pear, fig) to the light amber stage.
you can get the same by caramelizing sugar during your wort boil, i assume, but maybe not as intense, considering that sugar boils at a higher temperature than water.

so, grub, i know that you just add sugar to make your quads, but you may want to consider rock candy (or making your own) for future quads. we're talking about a 50-90 F difference in cooking temperature, so stuff is indeed happening that would be more "complex" than during a boil.

duncan · Post by **duncan** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:21 am

grub wrote:chocolate malt?!? i think the monks would laugh you out of the abbey.

Why is that?

atomeyes · Post by **atomeyes** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:01 am

duncan wrote:
grub wrote:chocolate malt?!? i think the monks would laugh you out of the abbey.
Why is that?

it is an english malt. think it's because them monks only stole from the Germans.