OCB Discovery Pack = pathetic

[Belgian]

... Propeller is still around after 10 years despite the fact there was supposedly no market. ... All with no market based on pure business logic. They succeeded by building up a market that wasn't there - there was only a potential for it...

Propeller's a great example - Unibroue as well, awesome product image. The stymied assumption that Premium Lager / nondescript label graphic is the ONLY business model to follow is rather blind - it fails to take into account that varied craft styles are actually perceived as different, brand-new products by consumers, and are seen as being very distinct. People WANT TO be excited. This stimulates new growth where "there was only a potential for it." So then, the expected "lager rules" for supply & demand prove to be nothing more than a limitimg belief.

The thing needs Vision not just bean counters.

[Bobsy]

The stymied assumption that Premium Lager / nondescript label graphic is the ONLY business model to follow is rather blind - it fails to take into account that varied craft styles are actually perceived as different, brand-new products by consumers, and are seen as being very distinct. People WANT TO be excited. This stimulates new growth where "there was only a potential for it." So then, the expected "lager rules" for supply & demand prove to be nothing more than a limiting belief.

And this is exactly why craft brewers exist, and are thankfully becoming more common in the province. I also think that by offering more choice and types of beer Ontarians are slowly being won over by the micros. I'd like to emphasize though, that this seems to be a slow progression. This doesn't mean that the micros should start to imitate Molsons and Labatt, but I do think that they are correct in reaching out a hand to those less adventurous drinkers by offering a package that would not scare them off. After all, the vast majority of beer drinkers are very conservative and loyal to the lager style. My father-in-law, for one, is very wary of anything that doesn't look like a Keith's or a (god help me for writing these horrible words) a lucky lager. He'd pass by any pack that didn't have at least 50% of its content in this style category.

So this got me thinking about how you could sell something great and exciting to someone who has had these options in the LCBO before and passed them by. Do you guys think a good approach from the breweries would be to create a pack that is 50/50 on familiar styles and newer styles? I was thinking maybe if you replaced three beers in this pack with say, nutbrown, coffee porter and sgt major, then more people would take a flyer on it, and it might help to develop their taste and lead them to new styles.

[Belgian]

After all, the vast majority of beer drinkers are very conservative and loyal to the lager style.

Sure there are some hopeless Blue Light dingbats who are simply afiraid of anything new, and they might be too jittery to 'trust' even an innocuous Lager such as Mill Street Organic - OCBA doesn't need the whole market obviously.

There are still plenty of people toward the adventuresome side of the spectrum. Hopefully, more than enough to create a supportive following for really authentic & varied craft beer. More than ever, Ontario people are becoming Explorers of taste and Seekers of unique specialty products to 'amp up' their daily appreciation of life.

It's not 1985 anymore. We have Whole Foods, Vintages wine. We have 20 cheese shops, 30 Artisan breadmakers and 12 Natural Meat sellers. There are companies selling nothing but varietal coffee beans or freshly handmade Belgian chocolates.

If each of these specialty goods had never come to exist, the public would still think the range of product was limiting and boring. But - and here is the key point of all this - a certain viable market has always existed, and people always had 'taste.'

[Bobsy]

Sure there are some hopeless Blue Light dingbats who are simply afiraid of anything new, and they might be too jittery to 'trust' even an innocuous Lager such as Mill Street Organic - OCBA doesn't need the whole market obviously.

There are still plenty of people toward the adventuresome side of the spectrum. Hopefully, more than enough to create a supportive following for really authentic & varied craft beer. More than ever, Ontario people are becoming Explorers of taste and Seekers of unique specialty products to 'amp up' their daily appreciation of life.

It's not 1985 anymore. We have Whole Foods, Vintages wine. We have 20 cheese shops, 30 Artisan breadmakers and 12 Natural Meat sellers. There are companies selling nothing but varietal coffee beans or freshly handmade Belgian chocolates.

If each of these specialty goods had never come to exist, the public would still think the range of product was limiting and boring. But - and here is the key point of all this - a certain viable market has always existed, and people always had 'taste.'

I agree that people are certainly more adventurous than they used to be, but surely these people would have already tried micro products, and its the people who haven't that the pack is aiming for?

[GregClow]

I agree that people are certainly more adventurous than they used to be, but surely these people would have already tried micro products...

Don't count on it, Bobsy.

I know plenty of folks who are into fine wine and artisanal/local/"slow" food, but who know very little about craft beer. When they do drink beer, they drink things like Sleeman, Stella or Heineken - but when I tip them off to something better, they usually like it a lot. It's just a question of letting them know that there's something better available.

And based on the fact that the media event a couple of weeks ago that launched the Discovery Pack included a presentation on how to include craft beer in your holiday dinner parties, and how to cook & pair food with craft beer, I suspect that this pack is at least partly aimed towards the more adventurous, higher end drinkers.

[A]

Fascinating thread. Bobsy, from a marketing background, argues that simple business logic should prevail. If you're going to introduce new people to the craft market, you lead with your top sellers. Anything else would be illogical; a compelling argument.

How do you expand your market? With me-too beers? Surely not. Maybe you'll get some short term switches but since theres nothing truely distinctive about what youre offering they'll switch again in a heartbeat.

The only real way to succeed is to offer something no one else has and that people want. Everything else is treading water.

[lagerale]

It would be really interesting to see how the actual sales of this discovery pack influence sales for the breweries represented in the pack. Might eliminate all this endless speculation on marketing tactics.....

[Asst. Grain Shoveller]

I'm very impressed with the amount of discussion and traffic this thread has generated.
Thanks for the kind words about our beers.

My main point is that our GTA market consumes about 7 million bottles of beer a day (or the equivalent, stat from the Toronto Sun a few years ago). That's a lot of beer.
Beer unfortunately is regarded as a commodity and its very difficult to change peoples minds that beer can actually have flavour and taste.
Craft beers are about quality not quantity.

We need to educate people about our beers and slowly introduce them to flavour in small steps. Some people can handle it and others just won't change their opinion.

Successful breweries sell beer that consumers want. Successful larger breweries for example are: Creemore, Sleemans, Brick & Steamwhistle.
Its a very competitive market and these companies are able to grow their markets, pay their bills, develop their markets and provide some return for their investors. Most of us smaller brewers are working towards that but it is a long uphill battle.
From a marketing and selling standpoint, us small brewers are still on the learning curve.

Support from the local beer consumers is critical otherwise we'll close.

We have to sell or we will fail. Educating the average beer consumer is a critical factor in our ability to grow. The OCB craft pack is just one step in that direction.

My suggestion is to use it for tasting with friends who don't know much about the local beer thats out there.

We'd appreciate the help!!!

Thanx & Cheers from under the desk of:
Ken

[SteveB]

Hey There,

I thought I'd shed some light on how the craft pack brands were decided on. As a group, we didn't have much money or resources to devote to the creation of the mix 6, but we all felt there was a real power in branding 6 different brewery brands together - combined with the OCB sticker, which would appear on the mix 6 + all OCB packages, there would be real power to connect all our breweries together.

Because we didnt have money or time as a group, the decision was made that one brewery (I believe it was Brick, but its been so long I'm not 100%) would lead the initial 6 pack and would figure out logistics as well as what brands would be included.

My understanding is that each brewery (not the OCB) decided what brand they wanted to include. Again, if I remember correctly, the OCB unanimously approved the process and while it might not have been perfect, if we hadn't done it this way there would not have been a mix 6 at all.

So there you have it, the inside scoop on how the six got picked.

[Queef]

Educating the average beer consumer is a critical factor in our ability to grow. The OCB craft pack is just one step in that direction

This is especially true in Ontario I think. I think the quote above about someone saying "hey this is like I normally drink, but more expensive" is a great point, but what if that only happens 8 times out of ten? And the other 2 are exposed to something they didn't even realize was local never mind existed.
I grew up in ontario and lived out of province for 7 years, until recently. It used to suprise me to be in my local store and have a line up of people at the cash with cases of Tree, Big Rock, Wild Rose etc etc, and see only a couple out of ten with Molson and Coors Light, rather than 99.9% of the customers buying off the "big 3 list" . The grip those companies have in canada is tightest here above anywhere else.
While it's a small step, I think it's an essential step.

[denguy]

The JR Brickman Pilsner is questionable to me since there are so few beers I find literally unpalatable (the word 'soapy' comes to mind.)

I don't know. I didn't mind it too much most times I've had it. The biggest problem i had in a couple bottles was there was tonnes of diacetyl -- i like buttered popcorn WITH my beer, not IN it.

That's it! Crickey, that taste has been bugging me. It's like friggin' butter.
Oh, thanks, man.

[denguy]

It would be really interesting to see how the actual sales of this discovery pack influence sales for the breweries represented in the pack. Might eliminate all this endless speculation on marketing tactics.....

I would say that I am of the target market as I am relatively new at this OCB stuff. "Hello, my name is Denguy and I was an Molson Export drinker. It's been two-and-a-half years since my last Ex."

Well, it has influenced me to not buy JR Brickman Pil, nor did I prefer the Muskoka Cream Ale. I live a streetcar ride from the Mill St. Brewery, so I've tried all they have to offer, and I already regularly enjoy the Wellington SPA. The other two I will try as soon as I get the butter off of my palette.

[denguy]

And by "palette" of course I mean "palate".