Victory Prima Pils

Zithal · Post by **Zithal** » Fri May 15, 2009 12:19 pm

I read on the main page that this is coming in soon as a year round listing. Is this actually true?

While there are a bunch of Victory products I'd rather have and, while I'm not a huge pils fan, this one is still nice. Plus, I'd like to support Victory product in the hopes that more come in.

Anyone with any information on this release?

Thanks!

GregClow · Post by **GregClow** » Fri May 15, 2009 12:37 pm

It is due to be in stores in June/July.

Philip1 · Post by **Philip1** » Fri May 15, 2009 2:13 pm

I used to go to Smokeless Joe's to get a bottle of this stuff. I once had Hop Devil IPA from the same brewery at Joe's as well. But they stopped getting Victory beers about 4 years ago.

esprit · Post by **esprit** » Mon May 18, 2009 6:46 pm

We sold Hopdevil, Storm King Stout and Whirlwind Wit to the LCBO for seasonal releases. The Whirlwind was the last one and the LCBO destroyred quite a bit of stock because a few bottles had exploded. The brewery claimed the product was not stored properly and withdrew from the market until an opportunity came up for a permanent listing.
On another note, Dogfish Head has once again been fined and this time for for "insufficient cohesive anti-skid agent between pallet layers" on their latest shipment of DFH 60. It now looks like they're going to pull out!!! Get it while you can.

Dokta Owange · Post by **Dokta Owange** » Mon May 18, 2009 7:05 pm

another reason to support R+R and Southern Tier.

Bytowner · Post by **Bytowner** » Mon May 18, 2009 8:24 pm

Ah feck! I really liked the DFH and really dislike the ST. That's a crying shame. Bastards.

SteelbackGuy · Post by **SteelbackGuy** » Mon May 18, 2009 8:37 pm

Bytowner wrote:Ah feck! I really liked the DFH and really dislike the ST. That's a crying shame. Bastards.

The DFH has been so difficult to get a hold of for me, that I've almost completely forgot about it. We sell a fair bit of ST IPA at my store too. But I don't buy either because I feel they are both priced at a prohibitive point, and I feel I get my money's worth elsewhere.

Still a shame that DFH is being "fined" for something so silly.

Belgian · Post by **Belgian** » Tue May 19, 2009 10:03 am

esprit wrote:We sold Hopdevil, Storm King Stout and Whirlwind Wit to the LCBO for seasonal releases. The Whirlwind was the last one and the LCBO destroyred quite a bit of stock because a few bottles had exploded. The brewery claimed the product was not stored properly and withdrew from the market until an opportunity came up for a permanent listing.
On another note, Dogfish Head has once again been fined and this time for for "insufficient cohesive anti-skid agent between pallet layers" on their latest shipment of DFH 60. It now looks like they're going to pull out!!! Get it while you can.

Does anybody ever determine a satisfactory fault resolution between LCBO and supplier that the brewers can actually see makes sense? Or is it all the LC's ignorant , high-handed power-tripping at the expense of the brewer? Clearly it's a huge effing problem brewers can't deal with anymore if they just cut their losses and quit our market this way.

I simply can't imagine a widely-recognized brewer getting pissed offf and leaving the giant Ontario system unless the LCBO were being WAY out of line with their iron-fisted assessment.

So..... who's driving to Buffalo?

Let's bust out of this pathetic backwater.

devonsleigh · Post by **devonsleigh** » Tue May 19, 2009 12:13 pm

[quote="esprit"]Dogfish Head has once again been fined and this time for for "insufficient cohesive anti-skid agent between pallet layers" on their latest shipment of DFH 60. It now looks like they're going to pull out!!! Get it while you can.[/quote]

DFH 60 is a staple in my household, I hope you're not serious.

esprit · Post by **esprit** » Tue May 19, 2009 12:29 pm

The supplier is quite pissed-off. 2 out of 3 shipments have incurred fines totalling almost $5,000 dollars. They can sell every drop of this elixir in the U.S. and they are now seriously considering calling it quits. The first shipment had a fine of $3,000 because the pallet configuration was not according to LCBO specs (number of cases per tier, numer of tiers. The LCBO is supposed to inform the supplier of these requirements but did not do so. They sent the shipment to an outside company who apparently employed brain surgeons and lawyers to re-stack the pallets. After the first fine, the supplier complied. All of a sudden, the 3rd shipment doesn't have this cohesive (the previous 2 did not either and DFH doesn't use this stuff for any shipments anywhere in the U.S. or the world). You can obviously understand the frustration. We're not out of the market yet and I'm doing my best to convince DFH to try to work with us. I've told them I"ll swallow the charges (and actually lose money) rather than throw in the towel. I'm sure R & R have been through the same sort of thing...comments? This is without question a subtle way of restricting trade. "You want U.S. micros...we'll bring them in for you...by the way, we'll make them jump through the same hoops Heineken has to jump through except Heineken can afford to do it and we know these small products cannot."

matt7215 · Post by **matt7215** » Tue May 19, 2009 12:31 pm

esprit wrote:On another note, Dogfish Head has once again been fined and this time for for "insufficient cohesive anti-skid agent between pallet layers" on their latest shipment of DFH 60. It now looks like they're going to pull out!!! Get it while you can.

we've heard this before about Orval only to then be re-assured that it will come back. im calling shananigans on this one. seems like a ploy to sell more DFH 60, IMO.

Roland + Russell · Post by **Roland + Russell** » Tue May 19, 2009 5:01 pm

Oh, yes - we have been through some similar things but in all honesty, most of the requirements are stated in the documentation that is available, here or there. Pleading for logic, forgiveness, leniancy... sometimes all these come into play. As an agent, we see it as our role to keep these things in check and to absorb or resolve all shocks and tremors. In reality, the trouble is threefold: a) we unintentionally fail to share all of the details and requirements with the producer; b) the producer, for one reason or another, fails to ensure total compliance by either not familiarizing themselves with all the rules and regulations outlined in LCBO materials or by not ensuring that the shipment is checked and that it complies; c) we all get t-boned on a nice sunny day by for crazy, unexpected mistake or accident.
Regardless of the reason, there is usually some kind of remedy that needs to be applied in order to make the product compliant - relabeling, restocking, retesting, repackaging. Unfortunately, these things cost money and sometimes they cost a lot of money.

Another unpleasant reality is that most of the producers that we find interesting are already quite well established in other market, thus having no (or perhaps, moderate) urging pressure to sell their good stuff here in Ontario. We just failed (believe us, we tried really hard) to convince Stone to give it a try in Ontario. Some of them heard about the requirements and seriousness of this market, but we feel that is not the only reason why they choose to sell their product elsewhere. Let's be honest, some buyers have better paying terms or simpler regulations but there is still business to be made here for those who wish to enter the game.

Speaking of ST IPA, we are doing our best to ensure that the next shipment of it (late June) comes at a lower price. Right now, the stock is almost depleted and other markets are thirsty for it as well.

We do apologize for not being able to provide details, stories and anecdotes - we respectfully submit that some information is a privilege shared by the buyer and producer. Hope you can understand this.

The_Jester · Post by **The_Jester** » Tue May 19, 2009 5:30 pm

So, to summarize . . . LCBO regs are driving Dogfish Head out of Ontario, and preventing Stone from entering. Am I getting this about right?

Roland + Russell · Post by **Roland + Russell** » Tue May 19, 2009 7:33 pm

The_Jester wrote:So, to summarize . . . LCBO regs are driving Dogfish Head out of Ontario, and preventing Stone from entering. Am I getting this about right?

As far as Roland + Russell and Stone Brewing Company are concerned, it is not the LCBO regs that are preventing them from coming to Ontario. At this point, they have no plans to expand into Canada. They are concentrating on their own domestic market.

Belgian · Post by **Belgian** » Tue May 19, 2009 8:22 pm

Roland + Russell wrote: Another unpleasant reality is that most of the producers that we find interesting are already quite well established in other market, thus having no (or perhaps, moderate) urging pressure to sell their good stuff here in Ontario. We just failed (believe us, we tried really hard) to convince Stone to give it a try in Ontario. Some of them heard about the requirements and seriousness of this market, but we feel that is not the only reason why they choose to sell their product elsewhere. Let's be honest, some buyers have better paying terms or simpler regulations but there is still business to be made here for those who wish to enter the game..

That almost implies that Ontario tends to attract craft brewers who really need the sales and just don't have enough solid options in the rest of the western world.

That makes me feel just a bit cynical. But it explains why beers like Chapeau Exotic remain, and so many world-classic beers - the one's that SHOULD be the pride of a good retailer - have gone and vanished forever.