The Art of Drinking and Driving

[iguenard]

Okay, so the title of this thread is significantly provoking. Intended, I must admit.

But nonetheless, if you are as passionnate about beer as the person to your left in these here boards, you've probably done it. I dont mean getting shitfaced under a funnel, but those one, two, maybe three glasses (the last being a half-pint out of guilt) of your good ol' pub brew before you have to hit the road.

By all means, we should, could, would never take the wheel drunk. I applaud those who are confortable enough to self-recognize the symptomns of being well under or over 0.08/5, yet feeling that it would be wise enough not to drive.

But in those cases where you drank one, maybe two glasses.

How do you make the decision to either a) stop drinking, b) are unfit to drive or more interestingly, c) decide you ARE fit to drive reguardless.

I like taking alcohol meter tests. When I see idle cops, I sometimes ask them for the favor. Rarely do they not oblige. Personally I've had experiences where I thought I was well over 0.08, yet "scored" 0.05. The inverse is also true.

So what's your trick, in all honnesty. What are youre "lines that cannot be crossed".

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

[LondonBeer]

We were having a similar discussion to this at the bar the other night. With the tightening of the allowable alcohol limits how is the average person to judge their blood alcohol content? They seem to be making the limits that much tighter but short of buying your own breathalyzer you are just guessing whether you are below the limit or not.

To answer your original question I will usually limit myself to 2 pint glasses of beer if not out for a long time or if their is food or something in between maybe another but it is all just guessing without taking an actual reading.

[iguenard]

To answer your original question I will usually limit myself to 2 pint glasses of beer if not out for a long time or if their is food or something in between maybe another but it is all just guessing without taking an actual reading.

The food in between really is a make-it-or-break-it for me. I will stop often at one drink if I feel like the drink is hitting me hard because I've drunk it on an empty stomach.

The way I see it, alcohol limits are there as defaults, but if the symptoms are strong, then really that should prevail over a set value of 0.08/5. If I'm tipsy or have slow reflexes at 0.02, then I wont drive even if I know I will pass the test.

So thank god for those free happy-hour appetizers.

[SteelbackGuy]

We have a system in Ontario that now punishes bar patrons for wanting to spend their dollars. We're criminals once we've had a second drink. Government should be doing more to curb urban sprawl and increase public transit that way people don't "break the law".

[mjohnston]

I'm just getting my license now and have never drank any more than a half pint of a session beer with food before driving. I've made the decision that if I'm planning to drink, I'm not driving. It's easier to make plans not to drive than to figure out what to do with your car once you've had a couple and you don't have to make a decision when your decision making skills are impaired.

I'm aware of a number of people who will have a few then drive, not ever having been caught, but have blown close on ride checks. They were surprised they blew as low as they did and admitted they really shouldn't have been driving. The cop told him that they would start issuing roadside suspensions to everyone at .05 (in effect now).

A limit that low means that a healthy weight male can't drink 2 pints of light beer and be sure they'll blow under. I think that's a great change - you can have one drink with dinner and you're done. That's the kind of strong messaging that's needed - anything more than one drink and you're running the real risk of losing your car. It's like the street racing law - you see a lot fewer people driving at 150.

[GregClow]

Where's the option for "I don't drive"?

[JerCraigs]

I am fairly sure that my personal "I would not drive right now" limit is actually lower than the legal limit. I don't really drive much anymore though, and the only time it really comes up now is for winery tours where we build enough time, picnics, breaks etc. into the plans to ensure that its not an issue.

Its still incredibly stupid, but I can at least see how people might end up in borderline to the legal limit DUI situations, especially out in the sticks where driving is pretty much the only way to get places. I think we are still far too lenient on people who are outright drunk behind the wheel.


Two pints of most craft beers is equivalent to more than three bottles of Molbatt's...

That said, I also think we should be required to take a road test at least every five to ten years anyways. There are too many horrifically bad sober drivers out there let alone impaired!

[Matty D]

Well living in a rural area this comes up a lot. You go out to a friends or a resteraunt and a DD has to be established in advance. Theres no other option as taking a taxi frequently would be cost prohibitive.

I usually stick with the 3 beer (bottle) rule if I'm going to be at that location for at least three hours. Food is a big factor along with what I'm drinking. Just recently I was at a gathering and had a Brooklyn's Chocloat stout @ 10% alc and had to change my plans because just that one beer was enough to tell me to slow down if I was going to drive.

Around here it is incredibly common for people to drive drunk, as in go out for wings and 6 beer then drive home, or worse. They just don't get it.

When I lived in Bancroft the joke was that if driving drunk and pulled over as long as you told the officer you're driving straight home it was ok

[Derek]

It's been MANY years since I did the smart serve certification, but the 'standard' drink does simplify things.

IIRC, one standard drink is:
12oz of 5% beer
5 oz of 12% wine
1.5 oz shot of 40% alc (mixed drink?)

The average 150lb male can supposedly consume 2 standard drinks over a 2 hr period & be okay.

So for example... 3 pints = 3x20oz = 60 oz = 5 standard drinks! So unless you're well over 150 lbs or its been a really long night... you're going to blow over.

[jaymack]

Im very fortunate to have a wife who (1) supports my homebrewing madness & love of beer and (2) doesn't drink herself. When out together I always have a DD.

Living in Oakville, I often GO into and out out of Toronto which also allows me to not worry too much about alcohol intake and getting behind the wheel.

If and when I am driving, and I'm drinking, I try to cap off at a 3 pint max over a period of time

[toweringpine]

A few months back when the 0.05 12 hour suspension was taken off the books and replaced by a three day suspension and a call to your insurance company; CFRB radio did an evening show to try to make some sense of it. The end result was that of the three test drinkers all had equal amounts of booze ( five drinks over three hours and I don't recall them mentioning that there was any food being consumed ) with a cop testing each with a breatalyzer after each drink ( giving time for the raw alcohol to get off their breath )... two of the three were over 0.08 by the end of the three hours ( but only by a small amount ) and the third never did reach the limit. One of them could barely speak but was just barely over the limit. What a dangerous thing to learn. I would never have guessed you could drink that much and be anything except way over the limit. Three drinks over a three or four hour session has always been my limit or two if it is a shorter session but never would I have five and even think of driving!

Several earlier posters have mentioned that eating is important in their self imposed limits... food does not lower the blood alcohol levels at all. It just slows the absorbtion into your system. Having some food doesn't make you any safer to drive it just means you will continue to get more buzzed while you are behind the wheel than you were when you stopped drinking.

[The_Jester]

A few months back when the 0.05 12 hour suspension was taken off the books and replaced by a three day suspension and a call to your insurance company; CFRB radio did an evening show to try to make some sense of it....

I saw that one! Venus got really hammered and wanted a hat, and Johnny kept getting faster and faster the more he drank!

[viggo]

A few months back when the 0.05 12 hour suspension was taken off the books and replaced by a three day suspension and a call to your insurance company; CFRB radio did an evening show to try to make some sense of it. The end result was that of the three test drinkers all had equal amounts of booze ( five drinks over three hours and I don't recall them mentioning that there was any food being consumed ) with a cop testing each with a breatalyzer after each drink ( giving time for the raw alcohol to get off their breath )... two of the three were over 0.08 by the end of the three hours ( but only by a small amount ) and the third never did reach the limit. One of them could barely speak but was just barely over the limit. What a dangerous thing to learn. I would never have guessed you could drink that much and be anything except way over the limit. Three drinks over a three or four hour session has always been my limit or two if it is a shorter session but never would I have five and even think of driving!

Several earlier posters have mentioned that eating is important in their self imposed limits... food does not lower the blood alcohol levels at all. It just slows the absorbtion into your system. Having some food doesn't make you any safer to drive it just means you will continue to get more buzzed while you are behind the wheel than you were when you stopped drinking.

I always thought the 0.08 limit was too high. I remember being at some wine event years ago where they have breathalyzers at the door for $1 or something. I think I blew a 0.09 and could barely walk.

[Ukie]

What I found surprising, when they lowered the level was, you could go out and have a DD, get home crash for 3 or 4 hours get up and drive to work and actually still be over the limit.

[Tapsucker]

We have a system in Ontario that now punishes bar patrons for wanting to spend their dollars. We're criminals once we've had a second drink. Government should be doing more to curb urban sprawl and increase public transit that way people don't "break the law".

Absolutely! I seem to remember a story years back that when Sweden imposed a zero tolerance on drinking and driving, their parliament also set new guidelines on hours of service for public transit. A friend over there told me they moved to 24 hour transit service in his city. At the time the streetcars were also free. I'm not sure if that's the case anymore, but it sure eliminates many excuses for driving!

I don't know what can be done in rural areas, but in the city we sure could use better infrastructure so people can socialize. As for the sprawl, I think most of those people are at home glued to their TVs anyway.

Personally, I take transit so I can enjoy myself. If I visit someone out of reasonable public transit reach or reasonable cab fare, I keep to two drinks maximum. I also don't bother going to any bars in the burbs. What's out there anyway, Jack Astors or some other crap? It's not like I'd be missing out on any good beer (or even good company) in a bar in Vaughn.