Perfect Pint Law for Ontario?

[Guybrush]

I think he's saying, "Don't bite your hand."
Excellent warning, Belgian. We should all follow this...

[Beer Snob]

I just take a graduated cylinder with me whenever I go out for a drink. Otherwise, how can I possibly manage to judge whether or not I'm getting fair value for my money?

I also take a digital scale to the grocery store, a stopwatch to the massage therapist, and I always have a tape measure and thermometer at the ready when buying pizza. But I suppose that's getting a little too far afield..

I presume you would be happy buying a car at full price and only having three of the four wheels provided or buying trousers with only one and a half legs (you're not an above knee amputee I trust). We should all be happy that someone is around prepared to sell us aparticular product.

[detritus]

I just take a graduated cylinder with me whenever I go out for a drink. Otherwise, how can I possibly manage to judge whether or not I'm getting fair value for my money?

I also take a digital scale to the grocery store, a stopwatch to the massage therapist, and I always have a tape measure and thermometer at the ready when buying pizza. But I suppose that's getting a little too far afield..

I presume you would be happy buying a car at full price and only having three of the four wheels provided or buying trousers with only one and a half legs (you're not an above knee amputee I trust). We should all be happy that someone is around prepared to sell us aparticular product.

Come on. These are totally useless analogies. A three-wheeled car, or one-legged pants, are useless. Nine-tenths of a pint of beer has nine-tenths of the utility of a full pint of beer.

Ontario already has a massive over-regulation problem when it comes to beverage alcohol. Do we really need more regulation? Not to mention the enforcement difficulties/impossibility.

I'm not happy when I get less than I pay for, but I'm intelligent enough to either ask for more if I feel short-changed, or vote with my feet and dollars.

-Josh

[matt7215]

"hey mom, that mean guy down at the bar didnt fill my beer all the way to the top again"

"well son, did you ask him nicely to top it up?"

"no. i just kinda sulked about it and left him a lousy tip"

"now son im sure its not on purpose, why dont you just point it out the next time it happens?"

"well i could do that......but i think ill just lobby my MPP for a perfect pint law instead. i mean at least i wont have to talk to anybody that way."

[Torontoblue]

"hey mom, that mean guy down at the bar didnt fill my beer all the way to the top again"

"well son, did you ask him nicely to top it up?"

"no. i just kinda sulked about it and left him a lousy tip"

"now son im sure its not on purpose, why dont you just point it out the next time it happens?"

"well i could do that......but i think ill just lobby my MPP for a perfect pint law instead. i mean at least i wont have to talk to anybody that way."

That's exactly what goes on now though. I've lost count of the amount of times I've heard people complain but not go back to the bar and ask for a top up; but conversely I've also seen people ask the bartender in a polite manner to top up their pint, only to be told it isn't their policy!!!!

So, we either need people to 'man up' either side of the bar and respect that people are paying their hard earned money for a full pint of liquid or there has to be some sort of regulation in place.

[Belgian]

Ontario already has a massive over-regulation problem when it comes to beverage alcohol. Do we really need more regulation? Not to mention the enforcement difficulties/impossibility.

I'm not happy when I get less than I pay for, but I'm intelligent enough to either ask for more if I feel short-changed, or vote with my feet and dollars

I could not agree more about voting with where I spend my hard-earned.

But Ontario has worse problems than over-regulation. Ontario has a massive problem with the public acceptance of mediocrity in service - from business OR government. It's the 'roll over and take it' attitude that - tacitly and cajolingly - other people try to reinforce through little social signals, as demonstrated well enough here. It's really because those people know full well they are being fucked and don't want to be reminded of it.

Sure, we can't 100% regulate bar servings, but for what IS possible people must at least demand it in the first place!! It has to be IN our culture, it's in the common sense of what we would find an outrage to be ignored.

Anything that puts our Governments on the defensive trying to please us is only good.

[Rob Creighton]

[quote="Belgian"][/quote]

Yup, what he said...but... he was way tooo Ontario about it. Must be on a gov contract

[Kel Varnsen]

As far as this issue goes, I am surprised that more bars haven't made it a marketing issue. I mean there are a few bars in Ottawa that sell their draft beers in glasses that look like traditional english pint glasses. But when you pick one up you can feel that they are obviously smaller. But they still sell a beer for the same price you would pay at other bars. So why are no bars going with the angle, that unlike their competitors their beer prices are for full English pints. It would seem like an easy way for a bar to get attention and raise some awareness of the issue.

[cannondale]

I just take a graduated cylinder with me whenever I go out for a drink. Otherwise, how can I possibly manage to judge whether or not I'm getting fair value for my money?

I also take a digital scale to the grocery store, a stopwatch to the massage therapist, and I always have a tape measure and thermometer at the ready when buying pizza. But I suppose that's getting a little too far afield..

I presume you would be happy buying a car at full price and only having three of the four wheels provided or buying trousers with only one and a half legs (you're not an above knee amputee I trust). We should all be happy that someone is around prepared to sell us aparticular product.

I was simply trying to remind anyone who is interested that there are a host of situations that we all encounter on a daily basis in which we trust our own judgement to determine whether we are getting fair value for our money.

In my opinion, government intervention in the form of consumer protection is only appropriate in instances in which consumers have access to less than the amount of information required in order to protect themselves. If you agree with this statement, you should perhaps consider asking yourself whether or not that is the case when it comes to the purchase of a 'pint' of beer. I think you will find, upon reflection, that we all have both sufficient information and ample cognitive faculties available to us to determine whether we are getting fair value in the purchase of a given 'pint'. On top of that, we all have fair opportunity to make that determination prior to committing to the purchase. I can't see anywhere, in this particular process, that I would either require or prefer to receive assistance from my government.

[Beer Snob]

Well, you guessed it, I vote with my feet. I rarely have the compunction to drink 'out' in the GTA. The LCBO has had a superb range of beers on offer over the last few months and I simply elect to drink at home.
I do occassionally travel further afield and am currently enjoying cask ale, real cask ale, not cloudy stinky or any othe way it is presented and charged in Ontario. I'm in the Uk of course. You try sending a pint back in Toronto! Very different from the UK. Full, lined pint glasses, samples before you buy and a no question replacement if you feel the beer is sub par and all for £2.40. Currently that is less than $4.00 a pint with tax and tip included!

[Malcolm]

You try sending a pint back in Toronto! Very different from the UK. Full, lined pint glasses, samples before you buy and a no question replacement if you feel the beer is sub par and all for £2.40. Currently that is less than $4.00 a pint with tax and tip included!

Big deal. I have done all of the above C'est What. It costs me more than $4, but I don't have to take a plane to get there.

[Belgian]

... I rarely have the compunction to drink 'out' in the GTA. The LCBO has had a superb range of beers on offer over the last few months and I simply elect to drink at home.

Very different from the UK.... and all for £2.40. Currently that is less than $4.00 a pint with tax and tip included!

It is slightly ridiculous here, the 'runaway' cost structure of Ontario pricing. Bars pay full retail, then have to mark it up quite a bit, then the customer pays tax and tip on all of that.

What is a pity about the Ontario pricing structure is that going for a pleasant pint out is one of the greatest & most time-honored ways to just be social. You can't meet people at home.

[cratez]

The LCBO has...a superb range of beers on offer

[Beer Snob]

cratez,

You don't think that the last couple of LCBO seasonal releases have been pretty good?

[cratez]

cratez,

You don't think that the last couple of LCBO seasonal releases have been pretty good?

The seasonal releases have been improving but their distribution remains limited, with many stores outside of the GTA receiving single shipments of beers that sell out within days. So 'seasonal' in this case means a few days or weeks to get in on the good stuff, as opposed to three or four months (i.e. an actual season).

The general list selection is abysmal compared to most other Canadian provinces and hoppy beers of any sort continue to elude the shelves of the LCBO. In fact, a couple of the best beers available (DFH 60 Minute & Victory Prima Pils) just got de-listed. That leaves us with Southern Tier IPA and, this upcoming February, Tree Double Hop Head IPA. Pretty pathetic considering the size of Ontario and the number of urban metropolitan areas within it.

Like I said in another thread, these days I do most of my drinking at beer bars and I'll likely be relying much more on cross-border beer hauls for acquiring quality suds. I'm not as concerned about 20oz pints as you are and with the exception of certain seasonals and some new arrivals like Netherworld, the Board mostly fails to meet my needs as a consumer.