2012 Cnd Brewing Awards discussion

[markaberrant]

They should be encouraging as many entries as possible. I don't see anything wrong with this. It drives up their revenue too. And if all they enter a bunch of crap beer, they still won't be winning any awards.

I've never agreed with artificially capping/stifling entries in a brewing competition unless you literally cannot manage beyond a certain number.

Asking a brewery to only designate 4 beers to qualify for brewery of the year seems like an extra special weird way of doing this. Par for the course.*

*I know this sounds very negative, but there has been some extremely bizarre practices over the years at the CBAs, and it seems like a new one or two pops up every year. This being said, they have made vast improvements, and should be applauded for what the CBAs have become. However, it is odd that several prominent, internationally known breweries still don't bother to compete, certainly don't hear of this at the GABF. If it was my comp, I'd be busting my ass to get those breweries on board.

[grub]

yep, pretty much my thoughts exactly.

[Derek]

I'm partly playing devil's advocate here, but I'm genuinely curious. I think I'd side with BreweryB in my examples above, but it gets more grey when you consider things like does having 4 gold-medal beers make you more deserving of BotY than having 20 bronze medal beers?

I hear ya. There aren't many breweries that do a huge diversity of styles really well... and I think that's the mark of a great brewery.

Given the location I really thought that Quebec would've taken a larger portion of the medals.

Yet somehow BC seems to have taken more than ever. About 40%! Any thoughts on that? I like a lot BC beer, maybe judges do too? Maybe the west-coast hopping makes some of them stand out amongst the others when judging (palate fatigue)? There's certainly a diversity of styles though. Or maybe it's just the sheer number of brews (there's bound to be a few good ones)? It'd be interesting to know how many were submitted from each Province... perhaps average score per submission? Yeah I'm a Geek.

[saints_gambit]

I'm partly playing devil's advocate here, but I'm genuinely curious. I think I'd side with BreweryB in my examples above, but it gets more grey when you consider things like does having 4 gold-medal beers make you more deserving of BotY than having 20 bronze medal beers?

I hear ya. There aren't many breweries that do a huge diversity of styles really well... and I think that's the mark of a great brewery.

Given the location I really thought that Quebec would've taken a larger portion of the medals.

Yet somehow BC seems to have taken more than ever. About 40%! Any thoughts on that? I like a lot BC beer, maybe judges do too? Maybe the west-coast hopping makes some of them stand out amongst the others when judging (palate fatigue)? There's certainly a diversity of styles though. Or maybe it's just the sheer number of brews (there's bound to be a few good ones)? It'd be interesting to know how many were submitted from each Province... perhaps average score per submission? Yeah I'm a Geek.

Sorry, hoss. Signed an NDA.

[mistermurphy]

The "choose your 4 best beers to represent your brewery" approach was implemented after Mill St. took brewery of the year 3 years in a row. Not only do they make a diversity of styles, but they made beers that also won medals.

Its more of an anybody can win approach, and I don't think it's appropriate for a brewery of the year distinction.

[Lackey]

and does it really count when there are some interesting absentees, like Dieu du Ciel and Les Trois Mouskatiers?

How do you know who didn't enter?

[Scottatron]

I went to the awards ceremony this year. It was a lot of fun. Many of the award winning beers were there for sampling.

Congrats to the winners for being acknowledged. More importantly, who has some Sawdust City Monkey beer for me?

This beer was really good on tap at the awards. I have a few bottles to trade if yourself or anyone else is looking for one. Send me a message if you are interested.

[markaberrant]

The "choose your 4 best beers to represent your brewery" approach was implemented after Mill St. took brewery of the year 3 years in a row. Not only do they make a diversity of styles, but they made beers that also won medals.

Its more of an anybody can win approach, and I don't think it's appropriate for a brewery of the year distinction.

So a brewer could enter a beer in every category, and win a medal in every one of them except for 4, and if those 4 happened to be the ones they designated for Brewery of the Year, then they wouldn't win it.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

[MatttthewGeorge]

seems to me a better approach would be to count a brewers top 4 beers that won that night, not the 4 beers the brewer choose.

for instance, let's say a brewery won 2 Gold & 4 Bronze yet that brewery choose their 4 beers to be the ones that happened to win the 4 Bronze. That would give them 4 points. I'm suggesting that they should take their top 4 scores from the night, in this case the 2 Gold & 2 Bronze, which would give them 12 points.

[grub]

The "choose your 4 best beers to represent your brewery" approach was implemented after Mill St. took brewery of the year 3 years in a row. Not only do they make a diversity of styles, but they made beers that also won medals.

doesn't that just indicate that other people need to step up their game? it's not just a matter of throwing shitty beer in every category, it has to be good enough to medal. if MS was able to do that, more power to 'em. If anything it should just drive everyone else to brew more, better beer.

[Derek]

How to win BOTY:

1. Pick 4 obscure categories
2. Brew according to BJCP guidelines
3. Knock their socks off.

Even a small brewpub could do it!



I'm sure there's at least a couple of 'gold medal' hefe's that weren't even entered...

[saints_gambit]

How to win BOTY:

1. Pick 4 obscure categories
2. Brew according to BJCP guidelines
3. Knock their socks off.

Even a small brewpub could do it!



I'm sure there's at least a couple of 'gold medal' hefe's that weren't even entered...

Not really. The difficulty becomes that if everyone is aware that that's the way to win, you end up with tactical choices to brew obscure categories. Indirectly, that might lead to greater variety in Canada, but directly leads to that loophole closing up as the obscure categories become less so.

[Derek]

How to win BOTY:

1. Pick 4 obscure categories
2. Brew according to BJCP guidelines
3. Knock their socks off.

Even a small brewpub could do it!



I'm sure there's at least a couple of 'gold medal' hefe's that weren't even entered...

Not really. The difficulty becomes that if everyone is aware that that's the way to win, you end up with tactical choices to brew obscure categories. Indirectly, that might lead to greater variety in Canada, but directly leads to that loophole closing up as the obscure categories become less so.

A greater diversity would be awesome. 'Obscure' is very relative though... for example, there's bound to be WAY more IPA's than hefeweizens entered. Heck, the last 2 gold medal winners (Fat Tug & Red Racer) didn't even place!

It might make sense to tally the top 4 scores (the judge's actual scores), rather than the medal standings... but then you could have the strange situation were nothing places, but you're best overall.

[saints_gambit]

How to win BOTY:

1. Pick 4 obscure categories
2. Brew according to BJCP guidelines
3. Knock their socks off.

Even a small brewpub could do it!



I'm sure there's at least a couple of 'gold medal' hefe's that weren't even entered...

Not really. The difficulty becomes that if everyone is aware that that's the way to win, you end up with tactical choices to brew obscure categories. Indirectly, that might lead to greater variety in Canada, but directly leads to that loophole closing up as the obscure categories become less so.

A greater diversity would be awesome. 'Obscure' is very relative though... for example, there's bound to be WAY more IPA's than hefeweizens entered. Heck, the last 2 gold medal winners (Fat Tug & Red Racer) didn't even place!

It might make sense to tally the top 4 scores (the judge's actual scores), rather than the medal standings... but then you could have the strange situation were nothing places, but you're best overall.

Or you could go with brewing what you want to brew well and consistently. Seems to work for Central City.

[cratez]

From a consumer standpoint I pay about as much attention to these things as I do to all the ridiculous blogs written by experts who've been drinking craft beer for 2 years. I have enormous respect for the BJCP but these awards are consistently muddled by questionable entries/winners and are mostly a reflection of who entered (as opposed to who's "the best"). I've always found that BA and RB scores and reviews by recognized beer authors provide reliable information for making worthwhile purchases. That said it's still good to see brewers like Great Lakes and Central City take home awards for truly outstanding beers. If slapping a CBA sticker on a can or bottle helps them sell more beer to people who would otherwise ignore them, I'm all for it.