In what intersection should Toronto's next brew pub open?

[Craig]

Guys, Danforth East already has a brewery. The Left Field open house is this weekend not far from Donlands. Plus there are plenty of excellent craft beer options in the area already. The Only, Wren, Sarah's, Morgan's, Sauce and The Only again because it's that good. If you go further East where the rent is cheaper, the locals get less friendly. There's a very large Muslim population there, which could limit your support from locals. Also, while TTC is pretty good out there, driving there sorta sucks, which limits the appeal of bottle sales to the greater area.

Pretty good? There's *literally* a subway stop at the corner of Danforth and Greenwood. It doesn't get any better. And the drive is better than to, say, Bellwoods bottle shop

Yeah, but Left Field is down at Gerrard.

Also, the Greenwood subway is actually on Linsmore for some reason. My first time trying to find the Subway to get to work from there was rather traumatic for me.

[grub]

Pretty good? There's *literally* a subway stop at the corner of Danforth and Greenwood. It doesn't get any better. And the drive is better than to, say, Bellwoods bottle shop

Yeah, but Left Field is down at Gerrard.

Also, the Greenwood subway is actually on Linsmore for some reason. My first time trying to find the Subway to get to work from there was rather traumatic for me.

OH MY GOD!!! NOT A 1.3KM WALK!!! THE HORROR!!!

I _wish_ I had something, anything, transit-accessible and/or walkable. I'd happily walk 3x that for a good bar/pub/brewery... you city folk have it too good and you can't even see it.

[lister]

you city folk have it too good and you can't even see it.

We do have it too good (many us of do see it!) and yet it could be even better.

Pick your poison for where you want to live.

[Belgian]

you city folk have it too good and you can't even see it.

We do have it too good (many us of do see it!) and yet it could be even better.

Pick your poison for where you want to live.

^ Must be tough that an LCBO A-store *and* Bar Hop opened across the street from you guys. Has to be tough on the home values. And I'm sure you miss having to walk almost a few km to beerbistro and ??C'est What??

Actually I've resolved to make better use of my semi-close locals that I do take a bit for granted, as grub rightly pointed out. I was not always 'city folk' and I seem remember what it's like there not being much at all...

[Belgian]

you're a local, so you probably see the strip north of the Broadview subway station as the place where bad ideas go to die. other than Broadview Espresso, i've never seen anything near there thrive.

What about the porn store that used to be Broadview Espresso - it was there for a long while Magic Oven was on the strip for a long time too.

Its true that no-one gets off at Broadview station and walks north, everyone walks east.

True so far, but it ALSO used to be true nobody used to go south of Queen on Spadina - before Jules Bistro brought that whole 'dead' strip to life by simply offering good cheap French fare.

I mean can't a brew pub thrive on Broadview as well as an indie espresso bar, in such short staggering distance of a subway station? It's not like Bellwoods on Oz was surefire as location either, they probably helped make it so because a GOOD brewpub is 'special' and draws traffic to almost-good locations (same with Indie in Junction I imagine.) Or muse about Pape south of Danforth, etc, some of these neglected haunts have to become the Spuyten Duyvil of the coming decade (yup, that's right folks everywhere is the future Williamsburg Brooklyn NY.)

A brew pub doesn't have to be on a high-rent strip, does it? No, I see you guys often at the existing ones and you humped a long mile to get there.

[lister]

^ Must be tough that an LCBO A-store *and* Bar Hop opened across the street from you guys. Has to be tough on the home values. And I'm sure you miss having to walk almost a few km to beerbistro and ??C'est What??

Oh it's super tough! The LCBO is like having a third cellar. It'll suck though when it's gone for up to two years when the condo construction starts. Fortunately the LCBO is going into the new building! *WHEW* I still pine for a five* story LCBO. And the very short stagger home from Bar Hop is murder! I can't tell you how many times we've done that and thought "Damn! That was... NICE!" Okay, I'll stop.

Actually we've been frequent C'est What customers even since we moved down here. Though now that the food specials are no longer daily that may reduce the visits. We would only visit beerbistro once or twice a year max. The price point was always a little higher and we don't really like the bar area. Plus it gets so damn loud!

Actually I've resolved to make better use of my semi-close locals that I do take a bit for granted, as grub rightly pointed out. I was not always 'city folk' and I seem remember what it's like there not being much at all...

I grew up out in the 'burbs, lived out in Ajax for a bit (shudder!) and am frequently up in Barrie and Innisfil. I know how shitty most bars, restaurants and LCBOs can be outside the core. One of the many reasons I paid the premium I did a decade ago for the small condo I have. You've got to decide what's important to you and live with the consequences.

* 1) Usual suspects 2) beer 3) wine 4) brown liquor 5) the rest

[atomeyes]

you're a local, so you probably see the strip north of the Broadview subway station as the place where bad ideas go to die. other than Broadview Espresso, i've never seen anything near there thrive.

What about the porn store that used to be Broadview Espresso - it was there for a long while Magic Oven was on the strip for a long time too.

Its true that no-one gets off at Broadview station and walks north, everyone walks east.

Mike, the owner of Broadview Espresso, likes to tell the story of him reno'ing that shop. there was a room in the basement that had a tv and a chair, i believe. he was removing the false ceiling, when a pair of used underwear fell down. guess someone was watching a video, got too excited and left the evidence behind.

the other problem with broadview and danforth is the lack of buildings that would size an adequate brewpub. if you're looking at 2000 sq ft as the bare bones minimum for a brewpub, then it becomes a challenge to find the space you need. even danforth between pape and coxwell...no buildings really fit that mold.

i was eying the garden centre kitty corner from the Only for a while. property was almost too big. also, opening up beside a mosque? not sure how cool that would have been, especially if one wants a patio.

[Cass]

Not sure if this was mentioned in the thread when Danforth was brought up, but some of the drinkers here will remember that the Granite had a second location on Danforth, east of Pape.

You can see an ancient BarTowel recap (written by me) here:

http://bartowel.com/regions/pubs/beerst.phtml

Clearly ahead of its time as it didn't make it.

[Craig]

you're a local, so you probably see the strip north of the Broadview subway station as the place where bad ideas go to die. other than Broadview Espresso, i've never seen anything near there thrive.

What about the porn store that used to be Broadview Espresso - it was there for a long while Magic Oven was on the strip for a long time too.

Its true that no-one gets off at Broadview station and walks north, everyone walks east.

Mike, the owner of Broadview Espresso, likes to tell the story of him reno'ing that shop. there was a room in the basement that had a tv and a chair, i believe. he was removing the false ceiling, when a pair of used underwear fell down. guess someone was watching a video, got too excited and left the evidence behind.

the other problem with broadview and danforth is the lack of buildings that would size an adequate brewpub. if you're looking at 2000 sq ft as the bare bones minimum for a brewpub, then it becomes a challenge to find the space you need. even danforth between pape and coxwell...no buildings really fit that mold.

i was eying the garden centre kitty corner from the Only for a while. property was almost too big. also, opening up beside a mosque? not sure how cool that would have been, especially if one wants a patio.

It would be a great use of that building though. It's a shame that garden center didn't last, that empty lot is an eyesore.

There are buildings big enough around there. There's the former Sun Valley that turned into a Bulk Barn (I think), that post office building (why the hell is there a sorting facility on a commercial strip like that?) and that huge place that keeps having failed bars in it (the last one was called Legion or something?)

[A]

Not sure if this was mentioned in the thread when Danforth was brought up, but some of the drinkers here will remember that the Granite had a second location on Danforth, east of Pape.

You can see an ancient BarTowel recap (written by me) here:

http://bartowel.com/regions/pubs/beerst.phtml

Clearly ahead of its time as it didn't make it.

I honestly have no recollection of this place - and I lived in the Neighborhood for 10+ years!

[TwoPint]

I've never noticed anything dodgy going on, and from what I can see of my new neighbours, income levels are skyrocketing, while the average age is sinking.

there's a huge level of dodginess. OATC just opened a clinic east of the Wren. OATC is addiction (namely, heroin/opiate) treatment. I work with the girl who helped open that clinic. says it is one of the sketchier clientelle she's seen. it is also quite busy already, meaning that the area was underserviced, meaning that there are mote opiate addicts in your hood than you know.

The OATC is well west of the Wren, right across from the LCBO.

Closer to the Wren is the ACT adjacent to Morgan's. While sitting at Morgan's front window one day I was entertained with a parade of sketchy characters going next door.

Be that as it may, I've walked that dicey stretch from Greenwood to Linsmore at night many times and have never had a problem.

[atomeyes]

and that huge place that keeps having failed bars in it (the last one was called Legion or something?)

can't see how that could ever fail

[Craig]

and that huge place that keeps having failed bars in it (the last one was called Legion or something?)

can't see how that could ever fail

Lol, they were closed forever renovating. Then they finally opened and nobody showed up. They tried a quick renaming, then they tried to look like a craft bar for a bit.

I lived like a 5 minute walk away and never once considered going inside.

[Tapsucker]

I honestly have no recollection of this place - and I lived in the Neighborhood for 10+ years!

Probably why it failed. Couldn't even register with a beer geek.

I think I recall Ron mentioning that was an effort for him to have a workplace closer to home. Maybe now that his kids are doing such a good job at head office he might be enticed to set up a hobby pub in the 'hood again.

[Tapsucker]

Be that as it may, I've walked that dicey stretch from Greenwood to Linsmore at night many times and have never had a problem.

The Linsmore Tavern would be a great conversion project.