Contract Brewers at Ontario Fests? No longer!

zane9 · Post by **zane9** » Fri May 02, 2014 12:21 pm

Left Field Brewery is likely the first target of ACGO's policy enforcement: if you are a contract-brewer you cannot serve at Special Occasions:

From their site: "it’s recently been brought to our attention by the AGCO that as a contract brewer, we’re only allowed to sell beer to three parties; The LCBO, The Beer Store and Licensed bars & restaurants. That list specifically excludes Special Occasion Permit (SOP) holders.

This is ridiculous beyond words, and I hope all contract brewers fight back. As beer fans, we need to lend our support.

Read more here: http://www.leftfieldbrewery.ca/news/why ... his-summer

El Pinguino · Post by **El Pinguino** » Fri May 02, 2014 1:03 pm

Wow.
But if there is an established set of exceptions and list of contract brewers and events to which SOP's have been granted for serving contract brewery beers, doesn't that set a standard that can overrule this "rule" if challenged by brewers like Left Field?

Even though I've never been to one yet, I'm sure even the Brewery Market events have broken this "rule" in the past, by serving contract brewed beers, no?

zane9 · Post by **zane9** » Fri May 02, 2014 1:22 pm

El Pinguino wrote:Wow.
But if there is an established set of exceptions and list of contract brewers and events to which SOP's have been granted for serving contract brewery beers, doesn't that set a standard that can overrule this "rule" if challenged by brewers like Left Field?

Even though I've never been to one yet, I'm sure even the Brewery Market events have broken this "rule" in the past, by serving contract brewed beers, no?

Yes, the rule is being broken by every single event that runs on a location not normally serving alcohol! I can't imagine that there is an established set of exceptions: that would make the "law" a farce. A legislative change is now impossible. A court challenge may be needed or the entire summer fest season (and private events) will be in chaos.

uno99 · Post by **uno99** » Fri May 02, 2014 3:09 pm

This rule has been broken at just about every beer event I've been to. Why do they chose to enforce it now and WHAT IS THE BENEFIT?

iguenard · Post by **iguenard** » Fri May 02, 2014 3:29 pm

uno99 wrote:This rule has been broken at just about every beer event I've been to. Why do they chose to enforce it now and WHAT IS THE BENEFIT?

Lobby.

You have no idea how much brewery-operating organizations hate these contract brewers... there is a huge campaign going on in Belgium and France against them. Apparently they are not brewers, but "beer designers".

That and macros tired of the competition, and complaints from their scarily clad festival attendants not having anyone to sell to before 1 hour before close.

icemachine · Post by **icemachine** » Fri May 02, 2014 3:35 pm

uno99 wrote:This rule has been broken at just about every beer event I've been to. Why do they chose to enforce it now and WHAT IS THE BENEFIT?

Bureaucrats: Afraid that someone, somewhere might be having fun in violation of the tedious rules they have imposed

Droogy · Post by **Droogy** » Fri May 02, 2014 8:14 pm

If i understand correctly, if it's sold through TBS or LCBO it's OK to have at a SOP event... so the answer is to have it as a listed product?

Or is it that you need to be listed AND be a full blown brewery

They are just saying it has to be purchased through one of their outlets if you have it at a SOP event. Same as you can't serve homebrew at a wedding.

mistermurphy · Post by **mistermurphy** » Fri May 02, 2014 8:38 pm

Your average brewery can sell their products under their retail store authorization directly to SOP holders. At beer fests, this would normally be kegs and casks.

Since we (Left Field) don't have a retail store, that's not an option for us. We're not able to list our kegs in the LCBO because that's not what they do. Technically, we could list our kegs in The Beer Store, but for draught beer that listing fee is $6,000+.

We are allowed to sell our beer to bars and restaurants, so I can't see why we can't sell our beer directly to SOP holders.

SOP holders are only allowed to buy beer from the LCBO, Beer Store and authorized brewery retail stores. I think it needs to be changed to included "Licensed Manufacturer's" which we are.

We've been informed by the AGCO that it wouldn't be legal for our host brewery to sell our beer directly to an SOP holder since it's not their beer to sell.

Kind of a confusing issue, but there currently seems to be no way around it.

atomeyes · Post by **atomeyes** » Sat May 03, 2014 12:11 pm

i feel very bad for the Left Field people.
trying to make an honest living and then to get caught in red tape.
the law exists. it was not being enforced.
there is zero logic behind this law existing and it needs to go.
but it likely won't be changed for another 6-12 months, if at all.

this also means that events like Beer4Boobs and Cask Days may have issues?

My guess is that1 of 2 things happened.

first, there were apparently cuts at the AGCO. so odds are that current employees are trying to make their mark and enforce the laws for their own job preservation.
but more than likely, there were a brewery or 2 that complained to the AGCO. it could be a big brewery that didn't like Left Field taking away a small fraction of their business. or it could have been any bricks and mortar brewery that felt threatened by Left Field.

all the more reason to vote the Liberals out this June.

admviolin · Post by **admviolin** » Sat May 03, 2014 5:55 pm

What does this mean for Cask Days? Could contract brewers sell casks to BarVolo and then can BarVolo "dispense" their own stock at a different site?

TheSevenDuffs · Post by **TheSevenDuffs** » Sat May 03, 2014 6:42 pm

atomeyes wrote:it could be a big brewery that didn't like Left Field taking away a small fraction of their business. or it could have been any bricks and mortar brewery that felt threatened by Left Field.

The cynic in me agrees with you on this one...

Droogy · Post by **Droogy** » Sat May 03, 2014 6:57 pm

mistermurphy wrote:
We've been informed by the AGCO that it wouldn't be legal for our host brewery to sell our beer directly to an SOP holder since it's not their beer to sell.

Sounds like a opportunity for a fancy temporary contract between you and host for any beer destined for festivals to actually be their beer. The Barley DaysxLeft Field 6-4-3.

Think of it as a collab.

If they fight dirty...start fighting smarter.

ercousin · Post by **ercousin** » Sat May 03, 2014 7:04 pm

Droogy wrote:If i understand correctly, if it's sold through TBS or LCBO it's OK to have at a SOP event... so the answer is to have it as a listed product?

Or is it that you need to be listed AND be a full blown brewery

They are just saying it has to be purchased through one of their outlets if you have it at a SOP event. Same as you can't serve homebrew at a wedding.

You can serve homebrew at weddings.

"Homemade wine/beer

Weddings or other religious events

Homemade wine and beer can only be served
but not sold at a wedding or other religious
event. An event is considered to be a religious
event when it is presided over by an
officiant.
This means a religious ceremony conducted
by persons such as priests, ministers,
Justices of the Peace, rabbis, etc.
Examples of religious occasions are weddings,
bar mitzvahs, baptisms, etc. Wedding
vow renewals do not qualify as a religious
occasion, unless presided over by an
officiant.
The wine/beer must be made by a member
of the family hosting the event. The permit
holder may not sell the wine/beer.

Wine/beer club/association/group

The objects of the club/association/group are
the testing, exhibition and judging of wine/
beer made by its members. Wine/beer may
only be served to members of the club/association/
group. No service is allowed to the
public. These events must be No Sale events
and alcohol must be served without charge."

http://www.agco.on.ca/forms/en/1575_a.pdf

iguenard · Post by **iguenard** » Sun May 04, 2014 7:39 am

http://www.lesoir.be/535112/article/deb ... artisanaux

To support my earlier statements.

Tapsucker · Post by **Tapsucker** » Sun May 04, 2014 7:55 pm

ercousin wrote:
Droogy wrote:If i understand correctly, if it's sold through TBS or LCBO it's OK to have at a SOP event... so the answer is to have it as a listed product?

Or is it that you need to be listed AND be a full blown brewery

They are just saying it has to be purchased through one of their outlets if you have it at a SOP event. Same as you can't serve homebrew at a wedding.
You can serve homebrew at weddings.

"Homemade wine/beer

Weddings or other religious events

Homemade wine and beer can only be served
but not sold at a wedding or other religious
event. An event is considered to be a religious
event when it is presided over by an
officiant.
This means a religious ceremony conducted
by persons such as priests, ministers,
Justices of the Peace, rabbis, etc.
Examples of religious occasions are weddings,
bar mitzvahs, baptisms, etc. Wedding
vow renewals do not qualify as a religious
occasion, unless presided over by an
officiant.
The wine/beer must be made by a member
of the family hosting the event. The permit
holder may not sell the wine/beer.

Wine/beer club/association/group

The objects of the club/association/group are
the testing, exhibition and judging of wine/
beer made by its members. Wine/beer may
only be served to members of the club/association/
group. No service is allowed to the
public. These events must be No Sale events
and alcohol must be served without charge."

http://www.agco.on.ca/forms/en/1575_a.pdf

Well that pretty much discriminates against us atheists who might want to throw a big party...