The Bar Towel

Kel Varnsen wrote: If they could sell all 1000 bottles of beer in Ottawa

Because they can't! Plain and simple. You are right, that their margins are higher on a bottle sold in Ottawa compared to Toronto, so if they could sell 100% of their beer in Ottawa, they would!

There are other things to consider as well, such as longer-term planning. If, as you say, they could sell 100% of their beer in the Ottawa area NOW, perhaps they plan to expand in the near term and thus getting their beer across the province serves as a marketing tool to build their brand in anticipation of their expansion.

On the distribution thing, I'm not sure what you're faulting Beau's for at this point.

Given that the LCBO/TBS are basically the only province-wide retail distribution option, how many ON breweries of reasonably comparable size have had more skus in the system? Assuming Gose and Tom Green make it, they'll be approaching 12-15 different bottles of beer sold in the LCBO in the last year. Great Lakes is probably in roughly the same ballpark after the big year they had. Anyone else?

What more could we really expect from them? I'd love to get access to every label that Great Lakes puts out, but I can't complain about their business model not getting them all to my doorstep.

Most of the one offs used to be 1000 bottles at the brewery or for home delivery. They sold them all every time. That was Ottawa only. It's not a matter of can they or not, they already did it.

Last year they expanded the brewery, and I'm pretty sure thats allowing them to send 15+ beers to the LCBO this year.

They have everything working well for them, except the beer quality, which could certainly be improved.

Kekumba wrote: They have everything working well for them, except the beer quality, which could certainly be improved.

^this^

Kekumba wrote:Most of the one offs used to be 1000 bottles at the brewery or for home delivery. They sold them all every time. That was Ottawa only. It's not a matter of can they or not, they already did it.

Last year they expanded the brewery, and I'm pretty sure thats allowing them to send 15+ beers to the LCBO this year.

.

Aren't those two points above contradicting each other? I don't doubt that when they were smaller they could sell their beer out locally, but they have expanded, so it would seem very unlikely that they could sell out 100% of their new capacity to the Ottawa area. The expansion was probably done with wider distribution through the LCBO in mind, a I assume?

Kekumba wrote:Most of the one offs used to be 1000 bottles at the brewery or for home delivery. They sold them all every time. That was Ottawa only. It's not a matter of can they or not, they already did it.

Although with 1 offs you have the novelty factor working in your favour. I mean last year when they released their Best of Beau's 4 pack like a lot of people I bought 1. I only really liked 2 out of the four beers in it to the point where I would buy them again. So if they were to re-release the exact same 4 pack, or if hypothetically it were a regular listed item, I doubt the sales would be the same as with the first batch, just because people like trying new things.

TheSevenDuffs wrote:Aren't those two points above contradicting each other? I don't doubt that when they were smaller they could sell their beer out locally, but they have expanded, so it would seem very unlikely that they could sell out 100% of their new capacity to the Ottawa area. The expansion was probably done with wider distribution through the LCBO in mind, a I assume?

I'm not sure what you are arguing about. Assuming Beau's currently sells all the beer they produce, we can almost certainly state with some confidence two things:

1. The vast, vast majority of the one-offs are sold in the Ottawa area. Sure, they put some into kegs around the province, bottles at festivals, and sure some end up at licensees. It's probably not 100% Ottawa, but it probably never was.
2. The rest of the stuff ends up spread around ON.

They expanded a few different times in the last few years, I think. That has likely allowed them to: a) put more beer (both standard Lugtread and things like the IP Eh, Festivale, etc) through the LCBO/kegs to bars; b) do more one offs.

I'm not sure how this is any different/worse than what most of the more aggressive breweries in this province are doing.

rejtable wrote:

TheSevenDuffs wrote:Aren't those two points above contradicting each other? I don't doubt that when they were smaller they could sell their beer out locally, but they have expanded, so it would seem very unlikely that they could sell out 100% of their new capacity to the Ottawa area. The expansion was probably done with wider distribution through the LCBO in mind, a I assume?

I'm not sure what you are arguing about. Assuming Beau's currently sells all the beer they produce, we can almost certainly state with some confidence two things:

1. The vast, vast majority of the one-offs are sold in the Ottawa area. Sure, they put some into kegs around the province, bottles at festivals, and sure some end up at licensees. It's probably not 100% Ottawa, but it probably never was.
2. The rest of the stuff ends up spread around ON.

They expanded a few different times in the last few years, I think. That has likely allowed them to: a) put more beer (both standard Lugtread and things like the IP Eh, Festivale, etc) through the LCBO/kegs to bars; b) do more one offs.

I'm not sure how this is any different/worse than what most of the more aggressive breweries in this province are doing.

I wasn't intending for it to be an argument, I just wasn't sure what his point was. We were likely saying the same thing and just not realizing it...

I do 100% agree with what you wrote...

TheSevenDuffs wrote:I wasn't intending for it to be an argument, I just wasn't sure what his point was. We were likely saying the same thing and just not realizing it...

Sorry, kind of bad choice of words. I guess my question was somewhere between "what are you arguing?" and "what are you trying to say?". Should have leaned more on the latter.

All good!

TheSevenDuffs wrote:

Kekumba wrote:Most of the one offs used to be 1000 bottles at the brewery or for home delivery. They sold them all every time. That was Ottawa only. It's not a matter of can they or not, they already did it.

Last year they expanded the brewery, and I'm pretty sure thats allowing them to send 15+ beers to the LCBO this year.

Aren't those two points above contradicting each other? I don't doubt that when they were smaller they could sell their beer out locally, but they have expanded, so it would seem very unlikely that they could sell out 100% of their new capacity to the Ottawa area. The expansion was probably done with wider distribution through the LCBO in mind, a I assume?

Oh, yeah, no...they definitely couldn't sell all their new capacity to Ottawa. I was just trying to say they already nailed down the Ottawa market, and the demand from Toronto folks seemed to be there, so they expanded the brewery to hit the LCBO across the province.

Honestly reading the thread again I'm kinda confused on who I was even replying to. Something went misunderstood somewhere.

Anyway, I like the b-side concept. Perhaps on top of bringing some good beers to Ontario, the Beau's brewers can learn some new things along the way.

Kekumba wrote:
Anyway, I like the b-side concept. Perhaps on top of bringing some good beers to Ontario, the Beau's brewers can learn some new things along the way.

Since we were in agreement all along, we can agree on one more thing...

matt7215 wrote:

Kekumba wrote: They have everything working well for them, except the beer quality, which could certainly be improved.

^this^

I get the feeling you guys are defining "beer quality" in terms of personal taste, whereas to me beer quality are things like cheap adjucts, infections, oxidation issues, quick aging, etc.

I've enjoyed say a third of what I've tried from Beau's, in terms of personal flavour preferences, but I've never had a quality issue from them, not once, and will continue to try anything new I can get my hands on, price permitting.

MatttthewGeorge wrote:

cfrancis wrote:I just got my hands on some fresh Frankenheim, Uriege and Schumacher. So I just picked up Festivale and Sticke alt to try that blind tasting. Last time I did it with Festivale and Rescousse from DDC. Without the spalt select hop, most North American breweries have issues really re-creating a true altbier.

Have you had the Alt from Killannan out of Owen Sound? I'd be interested in knowing your thoughts since you seem to understand they style much more than I do.

I have not but I will seek it out.

I also am trying to get my hands on Chuckanut from Washington. Apparently the brewer smuggled 7 slants of Kolsch yeast back from Germany in his baggage from a Koln brewery because in order to bring it in legally through customs was nearly impossible.

I really think that Kolsch and Alt are misunderstood styles in North America. Thankfully the home office for my company is located in between Dusseldorf and Koln so when I go to visit I get loaded on Kolsch, Alt and German Pilsners. So good at 50-75 cent euro per 500ml!!

Actually I'm hopeful and it seems like Creemore Springs will be remaking their collaboration with Schlussel Alt Beer. It was VERY good. I took a case of it to Germany last year and shared it there and it went over very well with the locals. Of course they sided with the German version.

MatttthewGeorge wrote:I get the feeling you guys are defining "beer quality" in terms of personal taste, whereas to me beer quality are things like cheap adjucts, infections, oxidation issues, quick aging, etc.

I've enjoyed say a third of what I've tried from Beau's, in terms of personal flavour preferences, but I've never had a quality issue from them, not once, and will continue to try anything new I can get my hands on, price permitting.

I've got to agree with this. My biggest issue with Beau's is they seem to mostly get wide distributions on beers in styles I don't particularly enjoy. Until recently with the Gose, which is a very welcome addition to the LCBO for me.

MatttthewGeorge wrote:I get the feeling you guys are defining "beer quality" in terms of personal taste, whereas to me beer quality are things like cheap adjucts, infections, oxidation issues, quick aging, etc.

I've enjoyed say a third of what I've tried from Beau's, in terms of personal flavour preferences, but I've never had a quality issue from them, not once, and will continue to try anything new I can get my hands on, price permitting.

This.

They don't make rotten beer, at least I've never had a "bad" bottle. I have really liked a bunch of the beer, found a bunch more just "meh" and "not liked" a small few. They are a brewery that I'll generally keep trying.