The Bar Towel

On 2003-11-20 07:36, Steve Beaumont wrote:
Fear not, boarderline, you are not getting ripped off at beerbistro. I know this because Brian and I specifically sourced glassware for the restaurant that would accommodate a full measure PLUS some room for foam.

That is good news. However, the shortness or otherwise of the pint is not my only issue.

As I said, I think that Bavarian and many Belgian style ales should be served with large heads, but there is something horribly incongruous about seeing English-style beer served this way. I would probably be happier to see a headless pint that is 1 inch away from the top of the glass.

And the tasters appear to be 50% foam, which again, just seems wrong. Empty space would be an improvement.

Just my 2 penneth...

PS I am glad that you now have the glasses for the Weissbier.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: borderline_alcoholic on 2003-11-20 10:16 ]</font>

Borderline,
I'd love to see you and a diehard German continue this discussion. I've seen Germans send back beers, scoffing, because there is not enough head on them, quite the opposite from the South (or is it North?) of England. As you point out, different cultures, different traditions. Generally speaking, though, the vast majority of brewers around the world prefer to see their beer poured with a head. There's more opportunity to catch the aroma and as far as they are concerned, it looks better. I think the English territorial practice of no head (excuse my French) has simply been maintained because the glassware has until recently not had room for head without shorting the customer.
Michael

Well, you may have a point. I tend to just follow the customs of the region which produces the beer. Consequently it looks incongrous, regardless of the rights and wrongs of the situation.

I also do not think it unreasonable to be able to ask for the (standard volume of)beer with no head (obviously I am not going to send a pint back over this issue, but on future pints it might be nice). The server was very clear that they had been given strict instructions to serve all beers this way with no exceptions.

And yes, I have had interesting good-humoured discussions with Germans on these matters in the past. My favourite such one was with a guy I know called Philip, who now lives in Austria. My favourite quote from him being "the trouble with German beer is that after a while it becomes warm and flat and then it is undrinkable, but you English have solved this problem by making your beers warm, flat and undrinkable to start with". Ha ha ha ha ha.

On 2003-11-20 10:35, the.brewer wrote:
Generally speaking, though, the vast majority of brewers around the world prefer to see their beer poured with a head.

But a full inch head!?! On an English-style beer!!?! Even when I have had pints in England in the new oversized glasses with room for a head, I have never ever ever EVER seen heads this big on English beers.

Don't get me wrong, I would be equally unhappy to see beers where a large healthy head is the regional custom poured without them, but the Beer Bistro seems to have them right.

Indeed, I am not really trying to put down the place, as I do quite like it. I just have one minor niggling issue, which I think should be resolvable by just allowing the occassional customer to have their beer served headless when they ask for it... And this will probably be easier once the pint glass measures are in place.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: borderline_alcoholic on 2003-11-20 10:58 ]</font>

Of course, there is also the question of serving English-style ales in anything other than a proper pint. One could argue that it may be confusing for some if different draughts come in different sizes, but it is very confusing to my tired little brain to drink Anglo-American ales and stouts by the half-litre.

I do not think that you can complain too much if it is *clearly* stated that a standard measure in an establishment is 500ml (excluding head) as opposed to 571ml (an Imperial pint). Like it or not we are in Canada not Britain.

I would prefer an Imperial pint, personally, but the Beer Bistro is openly forthcoming about what we are getting and though it is some 12.4% short of an imperial pint, it is not something that I feel we can complain is unfair.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: borderline_alcoholic on 2003-11-21 02:13 ]</font>

On 2003-11-21 01:47, borderline_alcoholic wrote:
I do not think that you can complain too much if it is *clearly* stated that a standard measure in an establishment is 500ml (excluding head) as opposed to 571ml (an Imperial pint). Like it or not we are in Canada not Britain.

I would prefer an Imperial pint, personally, but the Beer Bistro is openly forthcoming about what we are getting and though it is some 12.4% short of an imperial pint, it is not something that I feel we can complain is unfair.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: borderline_alcoholic on 2003-11-21 02:13 ]</font>

Wrong on two counts. First, the fact that we're in Canada not Britain is irrelevant becaues 500ml is not the standard serving size in Canada either. Germany, Eastern Europe, yeah, but not here.

Second, English-style ales are traditionally served in pints. And half-pints. I never said they were dishonest in their serving sizes, just that they were using an inappropriate size for certain types of beer.

On 2003-11-21 09:41, Josh Oakes wrote:
Wrong on two counts. First, the fact that we're in Canada not Britain is irrelevant becaues 500ml is not the standard serving size in Canada either. Germany, Eastern Europe, yeah, but not here.

I am not convinced that Canada has a "standard serving size" for anything. The use of UK and US pints are merely conventions inherrited from elsewhere (probably because the glassware already exists) and from what I gather from elsewhere on this forum and talking to people, bars can serve whatever measure they like, but do have to declare their measure...

So this being Canada is significant, as there simply is no standard here. It is just a mess.

Second, English-style ales are traditionally served in pints. And half-pints. I never said they were dishonest in their serving sizes, just that they were using an inappropriate size for certain types of beer.

I would tend to agree with you on this (and I don't recall arguing otherwise), but I suspect that we won't see this change. And 500ml servings of draught beer there is something I can live with.

Oh, and on a related note, I have seen discussion of metricising the UK pint elsewhere on this board, where people discuss taking 571ml and rounding it to 500ml. I wonder why nobody seems to ever suggest rounding to 600ml, which is closer to the current UK pint, and would probbaly find easy acceptance among customers.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: borderline_alcoholic on 2003-11-21 14:35 ]</font>

Hi all

My wife and I are planning to go to the beer bistro this evening and are quite excited about it. I was wonder how parking is in the area being that I have not been in that area of Toronto in several years.
Thanks Al

I believe that there is parking available around where Denison's used to be, which is very close to the Beer Bistro site. I am not sure how much it costs or anything, but there are at least options available.

Hopefully someone else can be of more assistance...

Wittekerke, Delirium, Petrus, and Abbaye des Rocs glassware being delivered to BeerBistro today ... to go along with all those lovely BOTTLED beers ... enjoy !!

Paul

Stopped by to say hello on Thursday afternoon and say the finished room for the first time. I real beauty I must admit. I also saw bartowels own Kid Presentable in the kitchen. Things are looking up for beer in Ontario.

There was an article in today's Star about the beerbistro & Blue Meaney:

http://www.thestar.ca/NASApp/cs/Content ... 0020183457

Popped in to the BeerBistro on Friday afternoon, awesome draft selection, so hard to pick just one! Since they didn't have Keith's I decided to try another IPA (Bwahahaha...) I enjoyed a pint of Scotch Irish St. Major's IPA, So cool to have it available on tap in Toronto!

The staff that I dealt with were attentive and helpful. When one of them asked me how I was enjoying the beer, he said something along the lines of "It's quite bitter eh?", I responded saying I figured it possibly/probably had the highest IBU's of any Canadian draft beer, he hadn't heard of IBU's, but did seem genuinely interested in learning...

I agree with Perry, the place is absolutely georgeous, I look forward to enjoying it as a new stop in our Church/Front St. pub crawls... (It'll be worth going a few blocks out of the way!)

Not sure if someone else had mentioned this - It's also completely non-smoking...

On 2003-11-30 16:50, JWalter wrote:
I responded saying I figured it possibly/probably had the highest IBU's of any Canadian draft beer, he hadn't heard of IBU's, but did seem genuinely interested in learning...

Pretty close: Corporal punishment, Perry's other hoppy nirvana has a higher count: I believe the beers are estimated at 83 IBUs for Corporal and 68 or so for S.Majors.

Both wonderful elexir I must add.

Daniel

On 2003-11-30 18:02, dhurtubise wrote:

On 2003-11-30 16:50, JWalter wrote:
I responded saying I figured it possibly/probably had the highest IBU's of any Canadian draft beer, he hadn't heard of IBU's, but did seem genuinely interested in learning...

Pretty close: Corporal punishment, Perry's other hoppy nirvana has a higher count: I believe the beers are estimated at 83 IBUs for Corporal and 68 or so for S.Majors.

Both wonderful elexir I must add.

Daniel

I know the Corporal Punishment has higher IBU, but it's so wonderfully balanced and complex, you wouldn't know it. In my opinion, Sgt. Majors tastes more bitter. In both cases, though, lovely beers.

Can we say off topic . . .

Joe