Gorden Biersch

tupalev · Post by **tupalev** » Fri May 28, 2004 10:11 am

I was at the Whitby, Ontario version of this brewpub last night. While not a huge fan, I thought folks might be interested in knowing their pints are now $3.50. I don't think we'll see them around too much longer, especially with a couple more pubs/clubs opening in that complex soon (and the Oakville location long since closed), so if you like the stuff (they had 5 brews on tap last night), it is at least very cheap for better beer than what is featured at the Boston Pizza next door. I tried their Dunkelweizen and Maibock for the first time (they were ok). Who knows, maybe the added traffic will help them out, but the people I talked to that worked there didn't seem too optimistic.

I think this is the most recent discussion of these guys for reference:
http://www.bartowel.tv/board/viewtopic. ... ght=gordon

burgermeister · Post by **burgermeister** » Fri May 28, 2004 10:33 am

I haven't had the pleasure of being able to try out either the Whitby or Oakville (when it was opened) pubs. However, I have visited Biersch resteraunts in the states. They typically run fairly large brewhouses (for a brewpub) and the meal pricing is fairly upscale. Not the type of place that would fit well into Whitby or the particular Oakville location they chose. I think they've pretty much overestimated the GTA market for their products.

dhurtubise · Post by **dhurtubise** » Fri May 28, 2004 4:35 pm

I don't know how this year's maibock is but last year's was KICK ASS! And for a brew pub to be brewing a dunkle weizen on top of the maibock in the GTA, this could be nothing but good news.

Guys!!!! We are crying like babies that we don't have a decent selection. We now have a brew pub with fresh and delicious beer, not to mention f**king cheap. If we can't support this effort, from a fairly local source, then we don't deserve any attention from those who are willing to try and provide our sorry cry-baby lamenting little holes.

Every beer I have ever had from Gordon Biersch (Oakville beers were/are? brewed at the Whitby site) was at least very good. Some were really outstanding (read maibock).

borderline_alcoholic · Fri May 28, 2004 5:32 pm

I agree that last years Maibock was phenomenal. This year's is not up to quite the same standard IMHO, but is still an enjoyable beer and it remains the best of their Seasonals (although there is talk of doing these more often). Sadly the original brewer moved to Steamwhistle, so I cannot see him brewing a Maibock again anytime soon.

GB did go through a period of producing very disappointing watery rubbish across the board for a while after the original brewer left and their last Seasonal release was horribly unbalanced, but things seem to have improved again recently. Of their general range, I'd recommend the Marzen if you are in the neighbourhood. Sadly, due to its location, I rarely frequent the place.

I happen to think that it may well be too late for GB to recover already given the ominous fire-sale reduction in drinks pricing, which is highly reminiscent of the Oakville branch's dying days, coupled with most of the original management staff seeming to have jumped ship over the past 6 months or so. All signs and portents that all is not well...

midlife crisis · Post by **midlife crisis** » Sat May 29, 2004 11:15 am

I agree with dhurtubise. I've driven out there on three or four occasions (it is a bit of a ways, unfortunately) and I think the beers have been consistently quite good - the equal of the old Denison's brews IMHO. I'm more of an ale fan but I think this is one of the better venues in the GTA (perhaps I'm missing something, but it and Granite are our only true brewpubs, aren't they?). It would be a shame if it failed. The location is curious though and I think the food is very highly priced for the target market.

borderline_alcoholic · Sat May 29, 2004 12:02 pm

midlife crisis wrote:I think the beers have been consistently quite good - the equal of the old Denison's brews IMHO.

I'd disagree with this. GB beers are of a generally good standard, but Denison's was (and in the case of the Weissbier still is) in a different league entirely.

midlife crisis · Post by **midlife crisis** » Sat May 29, 2004 2:57 pm

Well, I'd like to hear more, because I don't agree. I agree that the Denison's Weissbier is very nice. But I don't think the rest of the Denison's beers were "in a different league entirely". In fact, I think Gorden Biersch is making a superior Helles and Pilsner, hoppier and more distinctive, and a roughly equivalent Dunkels. It's a bit hard when we don't have the products at hand to compare anymore, but I've enjoyed the GB beers (the few times I've been able to go out there) as much and sometimes more than Denison's.

borderline_alcoholic · Sat May 29, 2004 3:32 pm

midlife crisis wrote:Well, I'd like to hear more,

Sure. Glad to oblige.

It's a bit hard when we don't have the products at hand to compare anymore, but I've enjoyed the GB beers (the few times I've been able to go out there) as much and sometimes more than Denison's.

I vastly prefered Denison's attempt at a Dunkel (which at the time was my favourite of the Denisons range) to the somewhat more watery GB attempt. Typically I would be drawn to the Dunkel in a line-up such as that at GB (or Dunkles as they were very keen to point out it should be called), but at GB I find that it is eclipsed by their Marzen, and sometimes even by the pilsner (and pilsners are typically not to my taste). I remember being reasonably happy with the Denisons Helles and I was never especially impressed with GB's at all. To me, the GB beers have never exceeded a good general standard, with the exception of their first Maibock which was excellent and the second Maibock which is very good (all IMHO naturally).

Denisons had two beers (the Weiss and the Dunkel) which I found to be excellent in their standard line up and a Helles, which was at least good. And I found what Seasonal beers I tried there to be highly enjoyable too. GB only ever has a maximum of one excellent beer (the Maibocks) and a couple of okay to good beers on tap at any one time IMHO. I do quite like their Marzen currently and this year's Maibock is pretty decent (it is only disappointing when contrasted to last year's effort).

Also, I have found GB beers to have been extremely variable during the time that they have been open. Denisons were always far superior at maintaining a constant quality between their different batches, in the time that I have been drinking Denisons beer - I have no idea what it was like before that, obviously.

To be fair to GB, with regard to their Pilsner I think that you have quite a good a point, but I have little interest in Pilsners in general, so this is of less interest to me anyway and I have probably overlooked it a bit for this reason.

the.brewer · Post by **the.brewer** » Sun May 30, 2004 11:25 am

midlife crisis wrote:Well, I'd like to hear more, because I don't agree. I agree that the Denison's Weissbier is very nice. But I don't think the rest of the Denison's beers were "in a different league entirely". In fact, I think Gorden Biersch is making a superior Helles and Pilsner, hoppier and more distinctive, and a roughly equivalent Dunkels.

I must point out that I did not make a Pils. I might have done one brew about ten years ago, but I cannot remember for sure. It would have been appropriately hopped.
One more quick comment - I agree on the location aspect - their choices always completely baffled me.
Michael

PRMason · Post by **PRMason** » Sun May 30, 2004 7:13 pm

I believe that GB and AMC Theatres have some sort of deal. There is talk about opening a location in Ottawa at Kanata Centrum, which coincidentally, is where the AMC 24 is.
Tim, ex of F & M, Elora, and Wellington, is now brewing at GB Whitby. He is a great guy and a huge fan of great beer. I believe the beers will be more consistent in future.

tupalev · Post by **tupalev** » Sun May 30, 2004 9:51 pm

I believe that GB and AMC Theatres have some sort of deal.

It has more to do with the property management Perry. Pen Equity seemed to be lining up the same folks for all of the AMC plaza's (Boston Pizza, Putting Edge, etc.). The last I heard AMC was trying to acquire all of their property from Pen Equity, so the direction of the complexes may change. I do know that GB had much more ambitous plans to expand along with AMC in Canada, but it just has not worked out. In your opinion, would this do well in Kanata? The Whitby AMC in constantly among the top 5 theatres in the GTA so exposure isn't a problem.

Josh Oakes · Post by **Josh Oakes** » Mon May 31, 2004 11:12 am

dhurtubise wrote:I don't know how this year's maibock is but last year's was KICK ASS! And for a brew pub to be brewing a dunkle weizen on top of the maibock in the GTA, this could be nothing but good news.

Guys!!!! We are crying like babies that we don't have a decent selection. We now have a brew pub with fresh and delicious beer, not to mention f**king cheap. If we can't support this effort, from a fairly local source, then we don't deserve any attention from those who are willing to try and provide our sorry cry-baby lamenting little holes.

Every beer I have ever had from Gordon Biersch (Oakville beers were/are? brewed at the Whitby site) was at least very good. Some were really outstanding (read maibock).

I have to object to this message, Daniel. I live in the city, and I'm not the only one around here who does. A brewpub in the farthest reaches of suburbia might as well be on the moon to me. It's not on my head or anyone else's that they've chosen to locate their pub in such a remote place. There's nothing I can do to support this place. Give me a location I can get to, and then we'll talk.

al · Post by al » Mon May 31, 2004 11:59 am

Alright. I live in Oshawa and I enjoy going to GB for a pint and on occasion dinner. But you city dwellers are funny. I work in TO traveling from beyond what Josh refers to to farthiest out reaches of suburbia in to the city daily. Anytime I want any good beer and have not thought of it in advance I drive into TO to purchase it, because I can hardly get any good beer in Oshawa. If I want to sit in a pub and enjoy a pint other the GB's beer, I head in to TO. Now I realize that GB location is a commute for you city dwellers. In no way am I asking you to leave your riches of beer selections to try or support a brew pub. But I had to say something because I took exception to your message Josh.
That's all for now. It's almost lunch time and I want to go out in get some Brussels white while in the city, becuase it has not made it to durham yet.

Al

Jon Walker · Post by **Jon Walker** » Mon May 31, 2004 2:41 pm

I guess I'm one of those funny city dwellers. But if you lived within a 15 minute subway ride from Smokeless Joe's, Biermarket, Volo, Blue Meaney, Beer Bistro, C'est What?, Bow & Arrow and the half dozen other exceptional pubs and restaurants in my area why in the hell would YOU truck over an hour to a single brewpub/restaurant with overpriced food and less than exceptional beer? Why would anyone?

And that's really the point regarding GB and their far flung locations. I love brewpubs, yes I do, but it's not my duty as a beer lover to support bad planning.

al · Post by al » Mon May 31, 2004 4:11 pm

Jon I seemed to have hit a bone of contention with you.

But seriously, the only point I had to make is about the travel. I guess distance is all a matter of perspective. And if your perspective is that going to Whitby is too far for a pint then that is that. I however will continue traveling to Toronto, Hamilton, or beyond in search of a beer or an interesting beer experience. So I hope you have fun enjoying the beer riches of Toronto. I will, even though I will have to drive 45 mins to downtown, or an hour and half to the Winking Judge (good that Dan lives there too, Hi Dan) I will.

So this is Al, way out in the farthest reaches of Suburbia, saying GOOD BEER HUNTING ALL.