What if Ontario held a beer revolution?

SteveB · Post by **SteveB** » Sat Aug 07, 2010 7:04 am

Sorry for the double post, but I was worried my post to the TFOB thread might get lost...

I will be speaking at 3pm at the Craft Beer Corner at the toronto Festival of Beer on the topic "What if Ontario had a beer revolution?"

I'm going to discuss the impacts to availability of beer, the employment created and the economic spin-off that would result if Ontarians chose to drink an independent Ontario beer for 1 out of every 2 beers they drank.

I hope some of you can make it down.

Cheers,

Steve

pootz · Post by **pootz** » Sat Aug 07, 2010 7:42 pm

Kudos Steve...you go dude! This needs to talked about publicly and the beer nerds should drive the discussion about breaking up distribution and import monopolies.

You have my respect and support for taking the initiative on this issue.

However, I hope you want open markets....like no swapping the govt. protectionism of the mega brewers for the govt. protecting local craft markets....open it up! I'm more than confident Ontario brewers can rise to competition from the US, other provinces and Europe.

Open access to beer from everywhere

saints_gambit · Post by **saints_gambit** » Sat Aug 07, 2010 8:34 pm

Anyone taping that? Seems like you might want to make it available to the public generally.

Kel Varnsen · Post by **Kel Varnsen** » Sat Aug 07, 2010 9:15 pm

Interesting idea Steve. Although I kind of think if every small craft brewer in Ontario worked as hard as Beau's does, getting attention for their product, you wouldn't need a beer revolution.

SteveB · Post by **SteveB** » Sun Aug 08, 2010 10:48 am

I totally agree with opening up the retail system, but I'm giong to focus on one idea - If Ontarians drank an independent Ontario brewed beer 50% of the time what would the impact be. Without giving too much away before I speak, it should create 315 new breweries, well over 1,000 more brands of beer 4,400 net new direct jobs, create entire new industries and more...

icemachine · Post by **icemachine** » Sun Aug 08, 2010 11:32 am

Would love to have you post your notes from the speech at a later date here Steve.

saints_gambit · Post by **saints_gambit** » Sun Aug 08, 2010 11:35 am

icemachine wrote:Would love to have you post your notes from the speech at a later date here Steve.

Yeah, it's too good a topic to leave hanging out at a festival like that.

carguy · Post by **carguy** » Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:26 pm

I agree with Steve. I don't even bother anymore trying to get people to try more flavourful beers, unless I know them well enough to think they may be receptive to the idea. What I do do though, is tell people that if you want to drink nothing but pale lager, at least try things like Stonehammer Light, or Wellington Trailhead, or Hannenberg Pils, and support local small business.

Queef · Post by **Queef** » Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:08 am

nice!

http://beausbeer.blogspot.com/2010/08/w ... ution.html

dutchcanuck · Post by **dutchcanuck** » Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:46 pm

Just read the post and I think one thing that would have to change is the tax structure on beer. I'll be 100% honest, when I walk into the LCBO and I see 500ml of Budvar for $2.50 or I can buy $2.65 for 473ml of Creemore Kellerbier, my gut is to buy the Budvar.

Now I FORCE myself to buy Hoptical Illusion more often than not, but many shoppers look at the price. $12.95 for that six pack of Hoptical is more expensive per milliliter. I want to support local craft breweries. Honest. I look forward to buying Smashbomb, when its available but, as long as Ontario Craft Beer is more expensive its a hard sell to the average Ontarian.

Just my two cents...and its worth about that much.

saints_gambit · Post by **saints_gambit** » Wed Aug 11, 2010 2:57 pm

Kellerbier was $2.95 yesterday and I was thinking the exact same thing. It makes you wonder whether it's a question of economies of scale or whether there isn't any protectionism in place for local products. It's something that should be examined.

SteveB · Post by **SteveB** » Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:22 pm

If price is your main concern, then there are beers that are produced in Ontario that are at the lowest legal price and up.

If taste is your main concern then there are independently brewed Ontario beers that can hit the mark there as well.

however if you look at the added (although somewhat hidden) benefit to buying Ontario-made beer, then it is the clear winner, no matter what price point you feel comfortable with.

Similar arguments are raised with respect to locally grown food and it takes an enlightened consumer to make the choice that is ultimately in his/her best interest - purchasing based on the retail price is often hiding a lot of hidden costs to the local economy, food security, available choice and community wellbeing.

dutchcanuck · Post by **dutchcanuck** » Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:30 pm

SteveB,

The point that I'm simply trying to raise is that when a consumer walks into an LCBO and sees a can of Pilsner Urquell or Budvar in a larger format, for a cheaper price than an equivalent Canadian product its hard to say they should buy local for the sake of buying local. I believe that local brewers should be able to compete in a global environment. Buying local should provide benefits and price is one of them that should allow them to compete against foreign brewers.

Correct me if I'm wrong, please, but doesn't the LCBO have some strange/bizarre tax structure that actually hampers Ontario brewers from competing with some of these foreign offerings based on price?

Queef · Post by **Queef** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:20 am

dutchcanuck wrote:SteveB,

The point that I'm simply trying to raise is that when a consumer walks into an LCBO and sees a can of Pilsner Urquell or Budvar in a larger format, for a cheaper price than an equivalent Canadian product its hard to say they should buy local for the sake of buying local. I believe that local brewers should be able to compete in a global environment. Buying local should provide benefits and price is one of them that should allow them to compete against foreign brewers.

Correct me if I'm wrong, please, but doesn't the LCBO have some strange/bizarre tax structure that actually hampers Ontario brewers from competing with some of these foreign offerings based on price?

Just quickly, your two examples
Pilsner Urquell - Pilsner Urquell Brewery
Plzeňský Prazdroj, a. s.
Production Output - 10 million hectolitres

Budvar - 2004 revenue - 2.4 billion (2004)

You aren't exactly comparing apple to apple here.

Who is complaining about paying $14.00 for a 6 pack of Victory Pils?

dutchcanuck · Post by **dutchcanuck** » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:33 am

Queef,

I'm just taking the point of view of joe six pack walking into the LCBO. He doesn't care about yearly production and annual revenue. He walks in looks at the shelf of beer and says what's good? and what's the price? I'm well aware of economies of scale, but Ontario craft brewers are located in our own backyard, surely cost savings can be had.

For example, I love going to TAPS brewery and getting a growler (2L) of a very good IPA (chuck Norris in the house), or their recent ESB for $10 bucks. I'm just playing the devils advocate. Personally, I find it annoying that Creemore will sell a can of their Keller bier (473ml) for 2.95...yes I know they've been bought out...or I can buy budvar, or hell Fullers ESB in a 500ml format for 2.25 or 2.5 depending on the special of the week. Now you might say, dutch...your arguing about a few pennies. But I am dutch, and start doing the math and it adds up.

I actually don't buy a lot of the american micros in the LCBO because they are prohibitively expensive in my opinion. Especially when I can drive to Tops in Niagara Falls and buy a 24 of southern tier or victory for under $40.