Dogfish Head

[cratez]

This is absolutely awful news and I'm really concerned about the impact this de-listing will have on the Board's future purchasing decisions. It's fine to have Yellow Snow, Garrison IPA, and Nasty Habit IPA come in as seasonals, but to me the true sign of a refined beer market is consistently strong sales of well-hopped, regular listing beers. And if the 60 Minute de-listing is any indication, Ontario isn't there yet. So once again we'll be hoarding like madmen when any seasonal IPAs or barley wines hit the shelves (and maybe the BO prefers that?).

For our own sake, let's hope price was NOT the issue here since $14.10 for six 355ml bottles (larger than most Ontario brands) of an extremely well-made beer is great value for money. Compare that to 6 Corne du Diable at $19.50. If price WAS the issue, I'm not sure that bodes well for similarly-priced U.S. micros like Prima Pils, Dead Guy, and Southern Tier IPA. Again, I find all of this quite disturbing.

The only potentially positive outcome of this decision will be more market share for Smash Bomb once - and if - it comes to the BO. But even if you take that 'glass half full' perspective, we're still talking about less variety for the craft beer consumer, and in the long run that's never a good thing.

Let's remember this de-listing when Smash Bomb is released (God willing). Clearly we'll have to support the shit out of that beer if other consumers are shying away from flavourful hoppy ales.

[Belgian]

For our own sake, let's hope price was NOT the issue here since $14.10 for six 355ml bottles (larger than most Ontario brands) of an extremely well-made beer is great value for money. Compare that to 6 Corne du Diable at $19.50..

Dogfish Head 60 (briefly) sold for 2.00 a bottle as a seasonal, then came back as a list product. That sixer price went up over $16 at one point, and has since been adjusted back a few times perhaps.

DDC is not Dogfish Head but if Corne du Diable got a general listing, I'm sure the volume scale could drop the sixer price quite a bit. I would not expect less than 13 or 14 dollars, how could it sell cheaper than it does in Quebec?

One final thought - maybe seasonal releases could serve USA IPA's really well, like Nugget Nectar arriving here super fresh just after its made. Would be great for the seasonal one-off's! Only problem is, the LC have these four very rigidly defined and over-planned releases, and then they go and screw up the arrival of store stock with so many delays. They never seem to get it together do they.

[cratez]

Maybe seasonal releases could serve USA IPA's really well

I don't disagree with what you're saying since freshness is important, but there's several lag periods throughout the year where the seasonals have sold out, or particular stores don't re-order them, and that's when it matters whether a solid beer is general list or not. If we rely completely on seasonal releases for good beer, and hoard the limited quantities like we live in some resource-deprived country where food and other products are rationed, we're ultimately settling for table scraps in terms of beer selection. It's a very pathetic situation overall.

As recently as two or three months ago I was under the impression that 'we don't have it that bad,' but considering we now have 2 general list IPAs, one of which is sometimes sour/infected (Sgt. Major), I'm starting to realize how dire things really are.

[markaberrant]

SNPA won't come in because it has to be shipped refrigerated and stored the same; the LCBO won't do this.

The other issues are price point and bureaucracy.

[Ukie]

SNPA won't come in because it has to be shipped refrigerated and stored the same;

Oh Oh, it does?

[Torontoblue]

SNPA won't come in because it has to be shipped refrigerated and stored the same;

Oh Oh, it does?

Well, that's what has been banded around on here and in small talk for years. Though they were OK with sending small private orders in, if you were prepared to wait for the appropriate transport. An old friend in T.O. used to get the SNPA as a private order for roughly $46.00 a 24.

[markaberrant]

SNPA won't come in because it has to be shipped refrigerated and stored the same;

Oh Oh, it does?

It doesn't HAVE to, but it certainly helps with freshness and shelf life.

Refrigerated transportation and storage has been standard practice in the US, although the corporate brewers are now telling the distributors this is not necessary... needless to say, the craft brewers that rely on these same distributors are not particularly thrilled with this direction.

[heebes]

is there a way to voice our displeasure? i too thought we had it allright but now im starting to think otherwise.
the loss of one of the most treasured american craft breweries is terrible.
guess i should have been buying it in droves.

i tried to private order a case of the 90 through the lcbo but there hasnt been a rfesponse for almost 3 weeks....not looking good.

[thebandit87]

well there goes my go to beer. Real disappointment they better start stocking southern tier IPA at my local LCBO.

[Belgian]

Maybe seasonal releases could serve USA IPA's really well

I don't disagree with what you're saying since freshness is important, but there's several lag periods throughout the year where the seasonals have sold out, or particular stores don't re-order them, and that's when it matters whether a solid beer is general list or not.

I think we have more or less proven that both the Seasonals and the General List are so badly handled, we can probably blame the LCBO's own practices for the so-called 'failure' of many good products in their system (or certainly failing to support great niche products with any kind of long-term view.)

The LC seems way happier to find some excuse to deny or eliminate a good craft beer product than to approve one or nurture it to success. I guess when they see money in niche craft beer they will change their tune. I'm hoping they form a great bond with DDC for example, a brewer smaller than Unibroue but with a similar market and more unusual products.

[markaberrant]

Yet another reason to brew your own! Drink fresh, tasty IPA all the time for dirt cheap.

[Cass]

is there a way to voice our displeasure?

Leanne Rhee is the category manager for beer at the LCBO.

http://www.lcbotrade.com/pdf/Merchandis ... 202010.pdf

Leanne Rhee
Category Manager,
Beer & Cider
416 365 5889
leanne.rhee@lcbo.com.

Why not drop an email and find out what happened?

[heebes]

well there goes my go to beer.

yeah, same...
i wrote Leanne, hopefully she has some insight.

Sam said a few years ago at the Dogfish dinner he'd like to see the Indian Brown Ale brought over, shame theres been no progress.

[SteelbackGuy]

I've tried the burgers. pretty good, plus you can choose from a variety of patties and tonnes of toppings. Plus they have craft beer on tap so it is a win win.

[GregClow]

part of me thinks the problem could also have been on the supply side.

I wouldn't be surprised if this was the case.

As many people in this thread have noted, sales of DFH60 have always seemed to be strong - but it has also disappeared from the shelves for pretty long stretches, suggesting demand was outstripping supply.

And based on the DDC feature and the improving quality of the seasonal releases, I'd say that it's pretty obvious the LCBO has a lot of faith in the popularity and sales potential of out-of-Ontario craft beer right now.

But hey, don't let that stop anyone from taking part in the usual LCBO-hating, Ontario-bashing, or conspiracy theorizing...