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All that I was responding to, and all that I care to respond to, was your initial post in this thread that included...
IMHO a different venue implies a larger one. Therefore it would mean an expansion of the event...not necessarily it terms of beer variety but rather in terms of patron quantity. I'm really not keen for the event to get bigger since each year it's felt like our own private jewel that I'm really not keen to share with Joe Sixpack.
...which to me indicates an exclusionist attitude that flies in the face of what I think this website stands for, and hence my taking exception. But if you perhaps misspoke in the above quotation, and moreover you are an ambassador for craft beer in this province, then I have no issue to dispute, thus bringing this pontification to a close.
Latin huh? Good for you.
Apparently you and I differ in our understanding of what "Joe Sixpack" means. You seem to feel the term can be applied to people who already drink craft beer which, in my mind, is a total contradiction. I'm actually not suggesting excluding anyone from the event, I merely pointed out that IMHO to move the event to a larger venue in order to cater to people who would have little if any interest in attending threatens both the quality and longevity of the fest. Is that really so hard to grasp? Once again, it's my opinion. Just because it differs from yours doesn't make it wrong.
Sanitas bona!
I don't always piss in a bottle but when I do...I prefer to call it Dos Equis.
Jon Walker wrote:Many of us here have long fought the good fight to spread the word about better beer and better beer establishments.
Oh, and don't forget that you also try your best to discourage any one from posting or making comments on Bar Towel if they haven't be long-time members.
I don't do anything of the kind.
Well, actually you do. You come across as insulting and condescending when you make comments like:
"the chorus here of speculating newbies"
OR
"We have only the word of a guy that has been on this site for a short time"
Apparently you and I differ in our understanding of what "Joe Sixpack" means. You seem to feel the term can be applied to people who already drink craft beer which, in my mind, is a total contradiction. I'm actually not suggesting excluding anyone from the event, I merely pointed out that IMHO to move the event to a larger venue in order to cater to people who would have little if any interest in attending threatens both the quality and longevity of the fest. Is that really so hard to grasp? Once again, it's my opinion. Just because it differs from yours doesn't make it wrong.
Sanitas bona!
I'll ignore the condescencion.
Nobody is suggesting that the event be moved to the Rogers Centre. But if the demand for tickets has outweighed the supply, which by accounts it has, then to move the event to a somewhat more capacious venue, whilst avoiding or at least minimizing any drop in quality, is the right thing to do. All else being equal of course. The unmet demand is coming from the craft beer initiate, not Joe Sixpack.
And when that demand is evidenced by an early sell out and excess demand for tickets then there will be cause to move the event to a suitably larger venue. But nobody can fairly claim such demand exists when the event sold only 90% of tickets and no more than 50% were sold on the official ticket sales day. I had extra tickets for the Friday night on offer for two weeks and I got a total of TWO inquiries...does that seem like overwhelming demand to you?
If I managed a band that hadn't sold out a venue that held 200 people why on earth would I try to book them into a more costly venue that held more? I don't know a single successful businessman who would increase cost/capacity until demand mandated such a move.
I don't always piss in a bottle but when I do...I prefer to call it Dos Equis.
Jon Walker wrote:IMHO a different venue implies a larger one. Therefore it would mean an expansion of the event...not necessarily it terms of beer variety but rather in terms of patron quantity. I'm really not keen for the event to get bigger since each year it's felt like our own private jewel that I'm really not keen to share with Joe Sixpack. Bigger events mean greater need for revenue which means more marketing and, all too often, lowering the bar somewhat in terms of quality. I'll use the Buffalo Brewfest as an example...from all accounts a shadow of the glory it was in its first few years....
A differnt venue may mean a bigger venue, but it doen't necessarily mean growth. One big session could replace four smaller sessions (4x100 = 1x400).
Jon, like many other enthusiatic beer lovers, can sometimes can come across as as a little elitist, but typically mean well. It's like when you are really into a band who have a small and loyal fan base and maybe you even know someone in the band. They are only playing small clubs, and the experience can be very intimate. But than whamo, they catch a break and before you know it, it seems like everyone and joe sixpack is a fan (who don't really appreciate the band like you do). If Volo is onto something good, let it evolve....they've done pretty good so far.
How about we all shut the fuck up, and let Ralph & the rest of the team do what they want with Cask Days, seeing how it's their event and all?
Sorry for being so blunt, but this constant whining and/or complaining and/or analysis and/or second-guessing about something that not one person on this forum has any ownership or directed vested interest in is getting really tired.
Hell, if I was Ralph and was reading all of this crap, I'd be inclined to just pack the whole thing in. Why bother with all the work and hassle for something that is just going to cause people to complain that it's too expensive, or too packed, or too small, or too successful, or too whatever...
Seriously, people. Think about it.
Last edited by GregClow on Mon Dec 01, 2008 11:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Greg, I appreciate your effort to brusquely end this thread but...if people on these forums stopped speculating and offering their opinions about the unknown aspects of our little beer universe I dare say you'd lose a good deal of the content here.
However...I've said all I care to so...I'll shut the fuck up now.
I don't always piss in a bottle but when I do...I prefer to call it Dos Equis.
Jon Walker wrote:Greg, I appreciate your effort to brusquely end this thread but...if people on these forums stopped speculating and offering their opinions about the unknown aspects of our little beer universe I dare say you'd lose a good deal of the content here.
Jon, I generally agree with you. I just think in this particular thread (and other threads about Cask Days, to be honest), things have gone beyond speculation into being... well, I don't know the exact word. Disrespectful, maybe?
I edited my post above at the same time you were posting my response. Maybe that will make my feelings a bit clearer.
Holy shit, Greg. Heaven forbid we all care deeply for a beer event!
I'll have to agree with Jon.
The fact that we all are enlivened by this thread about the Cask Days event is a testament to the greatness of the it. Weather we love, hate, complain or speculate on how it's run--we are all still thankful for its existence.
The only disrespect on this thread has been too each other.
"The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about."
Man. I just read this thread....kinda messy stuff. My only impressions about moving to a larger venue would be positive. I know plenty of people, myself included, who prefer their space and to grab a seat and contemplate and enjoy some brews. We're not all beer socailites.
From what I know about Volo on a regular day and what everyone has said about past Cask Days, it sounds like a rather loud, confined event.
